A boycott is in order folks.

"this isn't a baseball site, it is a post gazette site...."

Dear edog37,

 OK, you have made it official, you have no friggin' clue do you??  The name of this site is the "Pirates Forum".  The Pirates, you understand, are the baseball team from the city of Pittsburgh.  Pittsburgh is a city in Pennsylvania.  The Post Gazette is a newspaper (media) in Pittsburgh.

Based on the fact that you don't even know what the sites are about on which you post, I'm going to believe that you WOULD BE AT THE FRONT OF THE PARADE!!!!!!!!

Also, WHY DO YOU KEEP POSTING ABOUT BASEBALL AND THE PIRATES ON THIS FORUM IF YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS A BASEBALL SITE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  GET A CLUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Your posts hold little value if you don't know the basics of where you are posting.  Thanks for your input!!  Unbelievable, the guy doesn't know he's posting on a baseball site.  Geez.

A boycott will make no difference.There is revenue sharing(between 20-25 million last year).All that happens is you don't get to watch the game.It's a waste of time.This was already discussed a long time ago on the blog.Last year I think.

What about Ollie?11 wins.Karsten wasn't bad.Tabata will probably be up next year.Dan McCutchen had 2 starts and an ERA about 4.50.Nady and Marte have been hurt all year.Yankees got ZERO OUT OF THAT DEAL.

 

 

Hinske has been tearing it up with key home runs for the Yanks.

We have been their patsy, farm team for too long. 

 Maz,

With all due respect, you're wrong!!  IImagine (truly imagine, don't just write without thinking about this-- as if you were Bobbo & Co) what you would feel like if 2000-3000 fans continued to show up at your 36,000+ beautiful ball park to support your supposed professional baseball team.  Embarrassed and concerned come to mind??  Any human being recieving that type of treatment would be mortified.  And yes, Bobbo does fit in the human race category, and yes he would be embarassed beyond belief.  Imagine what you could say to the media in interviews or commentaries in newspapers etc??  How mortified.  In fact, so mortified that maybe it would become time to let someone else try their hand at managing and owning a pro baseball franchise.  It would be difficult to be seen in public if you were the Pirate management, honestly.

Yes, it would work.  However, there are a lot of people who go to the ballpart maybe once or twice a year to enjoy the atmosphere and the beautiful stadium the taxpayers of Pittsburgh built.  So, could we in fact generate enough interest with the fans to "stay away until Bobbo sells"?  Not sure.  Yeah, he MIGHT make a little if he could actually REDUCE the salary level of the team if 2 - 3 thousand show.  But how embarassing would that be when the headlines read:  "Bobbo Finds a Way to Lower The Salary of the Pirate Franchise."

Yes a boycott could work, plain and simple.  But it would take some effort, and maybe a little cash to generate the public interest to follow through.  If it got some legs you might see 5 to 10 thousand show up every game.  If it got tremendous support and only 2-3 thousand show, Bobbo would get the idea quickly that he either steps up and spends some or sells.  EASY.  But lots of effort.

Wow MJ,

You have a lot of misguided angst. 

If I were to hit you in your backside with a baseball bat, you would ask me what I did that for.  I would say - It doesn't matter, it is in the past.  You would reply, yeah, but it still hurts.  Well yes, these past 16+ years hurt, but they are gone, get over it.  Look at what is in front of us now.

Remember this is a business and you just can't change owners like you change your clothes.  If Nutting can run it and make a profit, good for him.  If you do not like the product, then buy all means do not support it. It is not like Cuban really wants the team.  Tell me who out there would want to spend the money to buy them.  Now I am a huge baseball fan and it pains me to see them lose, but I remember that it is more than a game - it is a business and Nutting is not in it to lose money.

So let's say that someone new did take over.  How would you go about making the Pirates a winner.   The team on the field, even before the trades was not good enough to be .500.  With that said no self respecting decent ballplayer was going to sign here as a free-agent.  So they had a bad team, no prospects to speak of in the minors, and they could not attract free agents.  Sounds like quite a problem.  The only real solution would be to start from the ground up - or the minor leagues.  There are three real ways to improve the minors.  1 is to draft well.  I believe the Pirates have had two very successful drafts the past two years.  2 is to spend money in the international market.  They just dropped 5 mil into a Dominican Academy and have signed a good number of international players over the last two years.  3 is to add to the minors through other means (minor league free agents, Rule 5, and trades).  Garret Jones and Donnie Veal represent the first two.  And and much deeper farm system has resulted from the barrage of recent trades.  The Bay deal at the time was looked upon favorably for the Pirates, since then it has begun to look worse all the time - BUT it was reviewed as a good trade at the time.  The Nady and Marte trade has already proven to be a steal for the Pirates and it was viewed with mixed results at the time.  Ohlendorf could be a quality workhorse, Karstens is worthy as a long man, spot reliever, McCutchen had a tremendous second half in AAA, and Tabata could end up being a top level talent (did you see how McCutchen and Tabata performed at AAA).  As far as the McClouth trade - we got a lot of potential back in the deal.  It has not looked great so far, but Morton has some nasty (as of yet uncontrollable) stuff, Gorkys is very atheltic, a great defender, and has always been highly regarded, and Locke pitched very well the last 2 months.  Nate is poor defender in center field with little range and a weak arm.  He is a .260 hitter with upwards of 25 homer potential, but not the type you build around..

All and all, your rant shows you have a lot of built up anger, but relies on very little actual facts aside from the fact that this all saved the Pirates money.  But wasn't Nutting the one that gave the OK to trade for Morris at 10 mil a year.  Didn't he give the ok to spend 5 mil on the Dominican academy, and around 19 mil on the last two drafts.  And oh yeah, we the Pirates are the only team to make an offer to Sano (I am assuming they offered 2 mil or more).

If you can get past your anger and look at this logically you will see that this was the only course the Pirates have in trying to regain any semblance of a respectable team.  Let's just hope that Neil and his staff are estute talent evaluators and the return we got proves to be more than just quantity.

I will glady go to the games, and I will be glad I will not have someone like you sitting next to me.

 

 

POPS

 Hey POPS,

Do your eyes work?  Look at the standings.  This is the 18th year of a rebuilding program.

Pirates management has been continuously developing-then-dumping talent for too many hurtful years.  And do you think Nutting isn't going to sell off these prospects when they are worthy of a decent contract?  

Why do Neil Huntington and Frank Coonelly still have jobs?

Bob Nutting, please sell the team to an owner that is committed to putting a winner at PNC.

 

LJ,

Again you have nailed it. As I watch the Astros beating up on our Pirates tonight, we are, no doubt in my mind, going to hit another 100 loss season.

The only way to avoid the embarrasing 100 losses, is for this team that Huntington is willing to go into the future with, must win 9 more games.  I can't envision that happening.

But, we don't need a left-handed relief specialist, because we have right-handed relievers that can get left hand batters out....according to Huntington.  

Why do Neil Huntington and Frank Coonelly still have jobs?

Bob Nutting, please sell the Pirates to an owner that wants to put a winner in PNC.

 I stopped going prior to the strike in 1994.  I haven't and won't be back.  Even if they win 5 World Series' in a row.

 Greyhound,

i called off my boycot when Bob Nutting bought the team, and he espoused to the media all the right things Pirate fans wanted to hear.

I was silly enough to believe he was actually going to change the mode of operation.

So last year I went to a few games, and this year I went to a few, and I had tickets to the August 2 Sunday day game,  but it was right after the Nyger Morgan trade.

That Nyger Morgan trade was the straw that broke the camels back for me.

I stayed home for that Sunday game, even tho the tickets were already paid for.

It may not sound like it, but I will always be a Pirate fan, but I don't like what my eyes have seen for the last 18 years.

I will go back when I see an attempt to win. The long suffering fans of Pittsburgh deserve better!

Why does Neil Huntington still have a job? 

My eyes obviously work much better than your senses or comprehension. What part of my post did you find fault with? I am not apologizing for anyone and I despise the losing and what Mcclatchy and Littlefield did to this team. Nutting is treating this as a business and since this business is profitable he is not going to sell. Now that we know going forward that Nutting will be the owner, I want to hear how you would have fixed the team. Since selling the team is not an option, what would your plan have been going into last year? POPS

P.S. A boycott will never work as long as the Pirates continue to get sponsors to pay for concerts, bobbleheads, free give-aways, and fireworks. POPS

 Dear Pops,

If you were to hit me is the backside with a bat, you're right, it would hurt.  Now, try hitting me with that same bat FOR 17 YEARS IN A ROW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  That's what Bobbo & Co. have been doing to the fans of the Pirates--and selling fools like yourself a bill of goods telling you things are gettin better!!!  How foolish can you be??  17 YEARS!!!!  AND COUNTING!!  AND THEY HAVE BEEN AT THE HELM FOR ALL OF THOSE YEARS!!  Did it ever occur to you to ask "if this is the ONLY answer, why the hell didnt' we do this like 10 or 12 years ago??"  Gullable is the only word I can think of.  Well, foolish is the other.  Oh, and after about 3 or 4 years of hitting me with that bat, you can bet your sweet a$$ that there would be retaliation---LIKE, MAYBE A BOYCOTT TO GET HIS A$$ OUT OF TOWN!!!! 

To answer your question, read my other post about how to make this team a winner.  They were very close--in fact twoor three starters (and about 10-20 milion) from being a serious contender.  Picture Duke and Maholm at the back of the rotation, mabe that'll help you visualize.  How about this outfiled, you pick:  Bay, McLouth, McCutcheon (even tho not REALLY proven yet), Jones (not proven), Nady, and don't forget about the guy who was tearing it up before he got hurt, Nyjer Morgan--a GREAT outfield.  In fact before they traded all that away, they had the BEST outfield in baseball--agreed to by EVERYONE in baseball.  Pitching needed 2 or 3 starters and the bullpen was fine--Gonzalez, Marte, Capps (needs help), Grabow, Gonzo, etc, etc.  Infield:  needed a 1st baseman (Laroche was eating up salary, and you could have done far better than him for like 8 million, cheaper even; oh and that great move was done by Bobbo's other great pick--D. Littlefield), and you could have gotten a 3 rd basemen with what you saved with Laroche.  Oh, how about Garret Jones as your first baseman--league minimum.  Best middle infield in baseball--1 a 3-time all star with the stick, and the other an average stick with tremendous defensive talent.  DONE, immediate contender--and all proven talents.  1 OR 2 STARTERS AWAY--BUT BOBBO WOULDN'T SPEND THE EXTRA 10-20 MILLION--and he still would've been at or near the cellar in team salary!!!  Oh, and you don't have to remind me about contracts coming up or injuries (happens to EVERY TEAM IN EVERY SPORT!) with the group we just gave away, because EVERY team in baseball has those challenges, not just the Pirates.  Oh, and don't forget, your selected team of the future will also have contract negotiations upcoming at some point, AT LEAST FOR THE 1 MAYBE 2 THAT MAKE IT THAT FAR!!!  Wilson and Sanchez wanted to stay so badly that they would have given up salary to stay!!  But these morons got rid of 'em for what, "hey lots of possibles."  Nonsense.  Most of these players will be out of baseball within 2 to 3 years.  "Hey, we got...............Nothin'.  More like fleeced again. 

For all that spending you listed above--it was just in the paper in which you are posting--Bobbo's savings this year:  8 MILLION DOLLARS!!!!!!!!  Nice Bobbo, nice!!!!  Continue fleecing guys like ol' Pops, he'll keep buying!!!  Hey, what, it's only been like a 17 year fleecing!!! 

Now, let's look at what you say they're doing--well, we don't have to quite frankly.  EVERYTHING and virtually EVERYONE you mentioned are "possibles and maybe's."  How's that going so far??  They are TERRIBLE!!  Yeah, MAYBE they get better in 4 or 5 years at this pace,(after 21 years of losing!!  21 YEARS!!!) but by then several contracts will be due,  and once again say goodbye--Bobbo won't pay.  He'll need to get a new giimick to sell to the fans--more peirrogie races or bobbleheads and a new gimmick to sell to fools like yourself.  Oh, and by the way, there is maybe one, mind you ONE, somewhat proven talent that looks like he might make it on a professional level.  NONE PROVEN NOW, just looks like he MIGHT make it.  Hey, we got big pitchers now though!!  For now--they are WAAAAYY below average.  Karstens??  Karstens??  You're kidding right??  Morton, Morton???  Kidding right??? 

Bottom line:  We got nothin'.  Bobbo is selling gullable people like yourself "the new and young future" idea.  Wow, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice (no make that 17 times) shame on me!!!

We now have a SS who can't play SS and a 2nd baseman who's learning how to play 2nd base.  I finally turned it off last night after watching a AAA team play a big league team--the Astros.  AND GET USED TO THE DRUBBINGS, IT'S GOING TO GO ON FOR ANOTHER 3-4 YEARS BEFORE THE NEXT GIMMICK BOBBO OFFERS!!  You keep up the faith there POPS, I'm done getting fleeced!!!

 P.S. A boycott will never work as long as the Pirates continue to get sponsors to pay for concerts, bobbleheads, free give-aways, and fireworks. POPS

Dear Pops,  (Please read posts above)

No one, no one,  will sponsor ANY team that draws 2 - 3 thousand fans per game.  Now, can a true boycott be done??  Difficult.  But no less difficult than having 17+ years of losing--AND COUNTING!!!  Hell, we're headed for 20+ easily from what I've seen on the field!!  There is not one proven major league talent on that fiield for the Pirates, and without PROVEN talent you can't  win at the major league level.  PERIOD.  No questions.  And there won't be PROVEN talent for 3 years or more--if at all.  Hell, let the results on the field tell the story--they can't win A GAME, or even compete!!!  And you really think that all this is going to change next year???  PUUHLEEASE!!  Stop being so foolish.  OR, even the year after!!  Please.  (Hey that would only make it 19 years of losing--not bad.  Please, stop.)

Sponsors even now have to be rethinking their commitments to an annual loser like the Pirate organization--with no end in sight.

Even Bobbo can be embarrassed enough to sell.  Hell, the guy wouldn't be able to have an interview.

"Since selling the team is not an option, what would your plan have been going into last year? POPS "

 

Dear Pops,

Selling is ALWAYS an option!!!  Just make it a scary proposition for Nutting (an accountant) to NOT make as much money--or break even.  OR embarass him into taking his profit out of the team by selling the franchise.  His equity in this franchise (money he's taken from the fans of the Pirates for years has been used to pay down debt in ownership. He claims that's money invested in the franchise, but it's truly money he's put in his pocket) is enough for anyone to consider taking the equity money and running!!  Yes, he can be embarassed into selling!!!  EVERYONE CAN!!  Hell, you gotta think with all the attention given to this new record of losing that he's somewhat embarrased NOW.  Hell, I would be!!  AND, so would you!!  Think about it!!  17 years of losing!!!  AND, no end in sight!!!  Next year we all know is a given--making it 18+!!  C'mon Bobbo, you gotta be a little embarassed now, aren't ya??

Well, maybe Bobbo thinks of it as a MILESTONE for a franchise owner!!!  NEW RECORD!!!  HEY, HE'S GOT A RECORD JUST LIKE THE STEELERS DO!!!!!  Well, not exactly the same--BUT A RECORD!!!!  You go Bobbo!!!

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