Post-Gazette beat writers Dejan Kovacevic and Chuck Finder blog about the Pittsburgh Baseball Club.
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HEAR YE HEAR YE
Next gathering Special Guest
Lou DePaoli
Executive Vice president and Director of Media Marketing
Date: December 5th.
Complete information to follow
Congrats to the Phils! Can the Yankees survive with everyone pitching on 3 days rest? Big question. Someone will have to come through big time. Will it be Pettitte? Or will it fall to CC? And can the Phillies build up enough of a lead to hold on in the 9th?
THIRD-sies !!!
********
Oh what a week it was...
Go Phillies....slay the EVIL EMPIRE.
Go Donnie Veal ...Congrats on being named the AZ League player of the week.
Morning Links
World Series Play by Play--Phils Hold On for 8-6 win
scores.espn.go.com/.../playbyplay
What goes into a team’s nickname?
www.bradenton.com/.../1825251.html
Like great-grandfather, like grandfather, like father, like son
www.columbiamissourian.com/.../great-grandfather-grandfather-father-son
Jemile Weeks, Donnie Veal Week Three Players of the Week
www.oursportscentral.com/.../releases
THE OFFICIALLY UNOFFICIAL PBC BLOGS AND MLB LINKS:
Why Gavs--Where have you gone, Carlos Garcia?
whygavs.com/.../where-have-you-gone-carlos-garcia.html
Sandlot Swashbucklers--AFL: Tabata Has 3 Hits In Scorpions’ Loss
mvn.com/.../afl-tabata-has-3-hits-in-scorpions-loss.html
The Green Weenie-Victor Black
oldbucs.blogspot.com/.../victor-black.html
PBC Home Page-Inbox: Will there be new 'pen additions?
pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/.../article.jsp
Rumbunter-Pirates Donnie Veal is AFL Pitcher of the Week
rumbunter.com/.../pirates-donnie-veal-is-afl-pitcher-of-the-week
MLB Transactions
www.cbssports.com/.../transactions
Bucco Fans-Pittsburgh Pirates Top 50 Prospects: 24 - Justin Wilson
www.buccofans.com/.../pittsburgh-pirates-top-50-prospects-24.html
Bucco Fans Wiki--Links to Much Info
buccofans.wikispaces.com
Fantasy Baseball Hot Stove-Pirates Prospect Tony Sanchez On the Hot Seat
fantasybaseballhotstove.blogspot.com/.../pirates-prospect-tony-sanchez-on-hot.html
Pirate Winter League Stats
mlb.mlb.com/.../org.jsp
Vote 2009 Awards--Cutch and Jones on rookie ballot
mlb.mlb.com/.../index.jsp
Jose Tababta sure is looking like he read the post gathering blog posts and saw where FC said no one will be held back.
I wonder if pedro and Blastings have started their off season programs?
It's Veal's Deal
Mark -
As usual me and you must disagree..... I disagree with all 13 of your statements you posted last night. We will have to agree to disagree I guess.
This is not a joke. I, and probably many in the asylum, received an email from pirates.com that links to a letter, dated Nov 2, 2009, from Frank Coonelly. I've reprinted it below, and you can find the letter and the additional link to the Pirates Blueprint on pirates.com.
So have at it, everyone.
---
Dear Pirates Fan,
As we begin the 2010 offseason, I would like to take this opportunity to let you know how grateful we are that you, our fans, continued to show your passion through some very difficult decisions to accelerate the overhaul of the organization during the 2009 season. Like you, we are extremely disappointed with the performance of our Major League Club this past season. But, for the reasons set out here and illustrated in The Pirates Blueprint, we are just as encouraged about direction of the organization and its future.
While the post-August timeframe receives the most attention from the media, our performance all season was unacceptable. As a result, we needed to take further bold steps to turn the organization around as quickly as possible. While the trades executed as we approached the trade deadline left the Major League Club shorthanded in some areas, these trades make us a much stronger organization for many years to come. As difficult as it has been to go through these growing pains this season, doing nothing to reverse the cycle of losing was simply not an acceptable option.
As we have said from the beginning, we are not interested in being just an average Major League Club. Our unwillingness to accept mediocrity has caused you additional aggravation over the short term. We regret that this was necessary but you deserve much more than a mediocre team. In the fine tradition of this city, you deserve a team that competes for championships. The bold steps taken this year, I hope, have demonstrated that our only interest is in giving you that type of team again. After supporting this great franchise through far too many lean years, you deserve nothing less.
The blueprint for our return to winning baseball was drafted two years ago, and it details the significant progress that has been made in building that winning organization. We all knew that it would not be easy to completely overhaul our system but the necessary groundwork has now been laid. We have worked very hard over the last two years to rebuild this proud franchise by focusing our energy and resources on the following core priorities:
Extremely aggressive drafts to acquire as much high-level talent as possible by investing more resources in the draft than nearly any other team over the past two years and securing top draft classes as a result.
Increased focus in our international operations to ensure we are in the best position to find talent in every part of the world where baseball is played by doubling the number of our international scouts, covering countries that had previously been ignored, tripling our international signing budget and building one of the very best Latin American training complexes in the Dominican Republic.
Aggressively adding talent at all levels of our system by trading veteran players who were approaching free agency for multiple young players over whom we have multiple years of control. Although we traded players who were popular, we know that what you really want is a winning team. We are very excited that several players seized an opportunity to demonstrate that they can be important parts of a winning team. The fact that other players have not seized that opportunity will play a role in our off-season decision-making.
Rebuilding our player development systems, including the way we instruct, train and mold our prospects. It is a cohesive approach at all levels that will allow our farm system to become the engine that constantly feeds our success. The fruits of this two-year effort were evident throughout the minor league system this year, but perhaps most apparent in Lynchburg where the Hillcats won the Carolina League championship based on a spectacular first-half fueled by Pedro Alvarez, Jordy Mercer and others and stellar pitching in the playoffs by five 21- and 22-year old starters (Rudy Owens, Bryan Morris, Jeff Locke, Justin Wilson and Nate Adcock).
Significant investment in our core operations which has greatly improved our scouting and development systems, as well as our baseball facilities and top-of-the-industry analytical systems.
The investment of money, time and energy in these priority areas over the past two seasons has made us a much stronger organization. The talent we now have throughout the entire system means that exciting players will arrive in Pittsburgh beginning in 2010 to join the group of young, talented players that includes Andrew McCutchen, Garrett Jones, Ross Ohlendorf, Zach Duke, Paul Maholm, Lastings Milledge, Ryan Doumit and others.
I cannot emphasize enough the appreciation we have for your continued support of the Pittsburgh Pirates. We understand that we have tested your patience but hope you understand that we have done so in order to make the blueprint for success in Pittsburgh a reality and to do so as quickly as possible. I also hope that, after reviewing the attached progress report, you will share our confidence that your patience will soon be rewarded.
Sincerely,
Frank Coonelly
President, Pittsburgh Pirates
Morning mates, good tidings.
A couple of interesting things seen while surfing.
Twins are talking about maybe raising their payroll to 90-100 million, but a lot of that would go to Mauer.
Cubs and Grabow talking 2 years, 7-7.5 million, maybe with another year vested.
Hopefully, today will be more peaceful in here and only 6 days till the GM meetings, I wonder if anyone will be covering it from the PG?
Drew -
Someone posted this letter yesterday afternoon. Nuho did some research and found practacally the same letter which was mailed in previous years by Kevin McClatchy and others..... take a look at yesterday afternoons thread. Funny, yet infuriating stuff.
I posed the question last night why most seemed infuriated with NoHu instead of Nutting and co, but no one even tried to explain this??????
Coonelly's "blueprint" is one of the most imaginative works of fiction I've seen in some time.....
1. They increased the scouting staff. - Two points here
A) How does the current scouting staff compare to other major league clubs? Comparing the increase strictly by internal comparisons is meaningless.
B) Why do they not follow their scouts advice and take the best talent available with the # 1 pick and instead reach down with the 4th overall to take a guy projected to be late first round?
2. They tripled the international signing budget.
A) Again, how does it compare to other major league teams international signing budgets? Again, measuring this against internal comparisons is meaningless.
B) They tripled it and still were outbid for the best Latin American prospect they've had the opportunity to sign in years.
3. Pirate City underwent $20M in renovations to ensure the proper environment to develop young players.
- This one cracks me up. So Frank Coonelly is taking credit for the $20M Florida tax payers spent on the ballpark?
4. The DR Facility - They spent $5M on the DR facility but took tens of millions of dollars out of the major league payroll over the course of 2008 and 2009 to compensate. And again, lost the best prospect they've had an opportunity to sign in years. Apparently it's a nice building, too bad they didn't sign Sano to play in it.
5. Development
- taking credit for McCutchen even though Littlefield drafted him.
- Crowing about Garrett Jones - a 28 yr old rookie of the year candidate.
- Crow about Zach Duke, 1st Pirate pitcher all star since 1995. - That is 11-16 w/ a 4.06 era and .285 OBA Zach Duke
6. Traded 16 players and received 29 players. - Great. How many are legit major leaguers? How much did the org save in payroll by doing this?
7. Doubled amateur draft budget. -
- but yet signed the fewest number of picks in MLB in 2009.
- Reached down with the 4th overall and bypassed the best player available for more affordable players.
- The increased budget does not compare to the millions the club avoided by salary dumping 16 veterans across two seasons.
Nothing but garbage, just like the letters McClatchy and Nutting wrote before Coonelly's.
Enough of the letters. - Just shut up and show something on the field.
That's really all that matters and by the way the one thing you continue to fail at, at historic proportions.
2.
Drew,
If we are going to post Coonelly's fine work of fiction, then I think it is only fair that we give former works of fiction from Bob Nutting and Kevin McClatchy equal attention.....
------------------------------------------------------------
Letter from Robert Nutting to Pirates fans
Saturday, January 13, 2007
Dear Pirates Fans:
Today, Kevin McClatchy and I announced that we have mutually requested Major League Baseball approve a change of control within the ownership group of the Pirates from Kevin to myself. This change will provide absolute clarity regarding the ownership structure of the team.
As Chairman and control person for the organization, my role is to provide strategic leadership to the organization. As CEO, Kevin remains responsible for the day-to-day operations of the ballclub.
I understand how important the Pirates are to you, the fans, and this community. Like you, I believe there is absolutely nothing more important than for our team to be able to win, not just for one year, but on a consistent basis. I am committed to providing Kevin and General Manager Dave Littlefield the greatest amount of support possible to accomplish that. Our fans deserve it, our community deserves it and I expect it.
In order to consistently succeed on the field, it's critical that we spend our resources effectively, while continuing to build our team from within. This is the plan I firmly believe in. It is one that Dave was brought here to develop and execute, one that he and Kevin are accountable for and one that I have confidence is working.
I am energized about our core group of exciting, young, talented players. We have one of the youngest teams in all of baseball and now will be able to keep them together for several years. Coming off last season's second half success, I am confident that this team, under the leadership of Jim Tracy, will continue to improve. I very much look forward to the 2007 season.
I am very proud to be the Chairman of this historic franchise and want you to be just as proud to be one of our fans. Thank you for your continued support of the Pittsburgh Pirates. I hope to see you at PNC Park this season, and for many more seasons to come.
Robert Nutting, Chairman of the Board
Pittsburgh Pirates
Read more: www.post-gazette.com/.../753508-63.stm
A letter from Kevin McClatchy
10/01/2005 8:00 AM ET
Saturday, October 1, 2005
Dear Pirates Fans,
I wanted to thank you for the amazing support you have shown the Pittsburgh Pirates during our 2005 campaign. Our attendance grew from 1.58 million in 2004 to over 1.8 million this year, which is phenomenal. This comes in the wake of a disappointing season on the field where our record fell well below my expectations, and yours as fans.
Over the last three years, this organization has had to make some very difficult decisions to get our house in order. We've done so, and because of hard work and perseverance, the Pirates are now in a much better baseball and financial position than we have been for years.
Dave Littlefield accepted the challenge of improving our minor league system and producing players from that system for the major league team. We have seen the results of those efforts as we've brought young, talented players like Zach Duke, Chris Duffy, Ryan Doumit, Brad Eldred, Paul Maholm, Nate McLouth, Ian Snell, Jose Bautista and Tom Gorzelanny to the major league club. They join a solid nucleus of players who continue to improve like All-Star Jason Bay, Jack Wilson, Jose Castillo, Humberto Cota, Oliver Perez, Mike Gonzalez, Salomon Torres and others. By far, this is the best group we have had in years, and there are still other talented, young players waiting to join us.
Now we need to hire the best manager possible to ensure that this group of players continues to grow and develop. Just as important, because of the tough decisions we've made over the past several years, we have the flexibility to grow our payroll next season by more than 30% from where we are today to the upper $40 million range. With these increased financial resources, Dave can obtain additional players that will complement our roster and help us to win.
We are very optimistic about 2006 and beyond, and we would not be in this position without the loyal support of you, the Pittsburgh Pirates fans. Thank you, again, for coming to PNC Park "the Best Ballpark in America" this summer. We look forward to a very busy and productive offseason.
Best wishes,
Kevin McClatchy CEO & Managing General Partner
Nothing that McClatchy or Nutting wrote about came to fruition.
Bob Nutting was chairman then, and he is now.
You must excuse me if I don't fall all over myself when good ole Frank writes a letter.
This organization has a history of writing wonderfully creative fiction and Frank's is just a bit more over the top what with the "blueprint" and all.
Hos - i expected no less. I was not posting opinion, just reporting, evidently a day late. Thanks for posting the older letters. It makes for interesting reading, no matter what one's perspective is. But my views might surprise you. more on that later
BFD, i missed it yesterday...i'll read some of the comments.
I think one thing the letters illustrate is that the Chairman and principle owner of the organization has a demonstrated history of being unable to lead and execute effectively.
He lead the organization when all three letters were written and to date the clubs on field performance has not improved. - In fact, it's gotten worse.
How my thoughts are beginning to change...
- i STILL support current FO's right and in fact obligation to have a plan. I was disappointed that the past FO didnt seem to have one
- i support the CONCEPT of the plan as they've outlined it.
But here's where i might be moving.
In the past i considered myself a cautious optimist, often posting that i like the strategy, and we'll see (but we'll hope) re: execution. The change:
Although i don't think it's been formally announced, i believe that PBC may plan to have a budget in 2010 that rollercoasters down just like their payroll. Dejan has reported that this team as currently constituted, with expected increases, totals $28 M. Last year, the budget was, i believe, $55 M. If the PBC took, say, $10 M and put it in infrastructure, debt payment, draft, etc, and still had a budget in 2010 of $45, i'd be perfectly fine with that. Even if you reserve $3 M of that for mid year needs, $42 M would leave $14 M to fill the OBVIOUS holes of this team (2B, OF, L relief) and leave the rest of the young guys intact...in other words, not blocked. It would be enough to get more than 39 year old question marks.
But...and i have not seen PBC make a formal announcement...i suspect that the budget will be dramatically lowered as well, to much closer to the $28 M. If that is confirmed, i immediately move out of the sunlight of optimism, but not into the shadow of pessimism. I will be in a lonely middle Missouri Show-Me spot.
I see no reason why PBC can't make the new lower payroll a win-win. Go ahead...pocket $10 M if you want for all i care, straight to profit, but spend the difference on baseball. The holes are narrow and specific. There is NO ONE immediately waiting to come up and fill them. Maybe in another year in the OF, but not yet. So make this a win-win...enjoy some profit and improve the MLB product right now, and ease some of our pain while we watch the Blueprint unfold.
I'm waiting for the announcement re budget before stepping into purgatory...but just wanted to go on record as to what the implications of certain decisions might be to this long-term fan.
...which means, if it plays out as i projected, i would be starting to question the strategy. To all the optimists...the FO has consistently said that at the right time they'll spend on free agents and fill holes. They have the budget room, and they have the narrow, specific holes to fill. I can't imagine a better time to do it.
sorry for dominating. This is my last post before heading to airport. (again!)
I think i've just put structure and thought to the phrase that PoH came up with, No More Make-Do. I don't mean to put words in PoH's mouth/posts, and don't mean to imply that she agrees - or doesnt agree - with me. But this is how i define NMMD, which is much more that a funny line to me...it is my philosophy re PBC.
I've posted before that my goalposts won't change....i'm making my judgment on this FO, or at least on the execution of the plan, sometime late in the 2010 season. These recently formed additional opinions of mine , i believe, are consistent with that measurement period.
Your "No more make dos" philosophy relates closely to my issues with filling the narrow, specific holes you have identified with inexpensive, flawed, 1 yr reclamation projects such as Rick Ankiel, Kahlil Greene, Hank Blalock, etc.
Honestly, I don't think any of those guys, uninspring as they might be, would come here anyway. We are that bad and unattractive a place for major leaguers to voluntarilty elect to sign with.
Frank and Neal better have a good dog and pony show for potential free agent players and their agents.
"It's the blueprint to a culture of winning"
srsly
It's a new age of enlightenment.
The emperor has no clothes...
I'm Spartacus.
I was just admiring the posts by Hostage/Self and, in fact, all of the other posts so far today. I wrote them all last night and have them on a timed-release program from my computer in the Fortress of Solitude.
I mean, what the heck, if the FO can issue the same apology letter year after year I can develop posts that sound like the same conversation is continuing from yesterday...
I am me and you are we and we are all together...
Jose
1
NuHo,
I'll respond sequentially since you were considerate enough to number your points:
1. Scouting
A) Most teams do not publicize the number of scouts that they employ so it is hard to get an accurate answer to that one. I do know that MLB does provide scouting as well for all clubs:mlb.mlb.com/.../scouting_overview.jsp
B) As has been discussed ad nausem here, there was no consensus of any player beyond the top two picks this year. Here's a quote from a draft preview:
"Due to the talent at the top of the draft being so thin this year, the widely held belief is that the first 20-30 players are interchangeable as far as talent level goes."
Now add in that the money saved drafting Sanchez was used to sign a couple of HS pitchers that were projected to be very high pics and you have an incredible talent/value ratio for that pick.
Also consider his first pro season stats:
48G, 33R, 18 2B, 7HR, 48 RBI, .309 BA, .385 OBP, .400 SLG, .949 OPS
2. International signing budget
A) Again, teams don't post this information so it would take a ton of research. If you are truly that interested and feel that it would be a valid point to bash the FO over the head with, I'm sure you would have done it already.
B) How can you be outbid when you are never given the chance to bid in the first place? The Pirates made an offer of over $2M to Sano prior to anyone else. When the Twins offer was presented, it was done so with the stipulation that no one else be allowed to match or counter it. Doesn't really seem like you are being fair or accurate in your assessment.
3. Pirate City renovations
He is partially. You are being just as disingenuous when you ignore that the team put up.
"About $9 million was covered by a state-funded program designed to keep teams that currently hold Spring Training in Florida from leaving for Arizona."
Where did the other $11M come from?
4. The DR facility
Boy, you sure are quick to make unsubstantiated claims. Can you provide the evidence that the money spent on the DR facility came from the Pirates payroll?
I'm pretty sure that any reasonable person could deduce that the minor league system was in shambles and had to have a talent infusion. Where was that going to come from if not trading current major league players for multiple prospects?
Just in case you try to counter the draft....yes, you can infuse talent that way. But they all would be at A ball levels. How do you get MLB talent into your AA/AAA levels?
A) Drafting != developing
Littlefield and Co. drafted a lot of players over their tenure. Can you show a consistent trail of well developed players?
The fact is, McCutchen was still in A ball when this FO took over and changed the procedures on how the minor league process would work. So yes, they can make that claim.
B) They should take pride in recognizing Jones' potential. That is the crux of their plan....evaluating talent and picking up players with it!
C) Duke was able to regain a lot of his composure and as a result, pitched very well this year. He fell off at the end, but it doesn't diminish his very strong year.
6. The trading of players
Only time will tell. I'm willing to bet that more of them will become very good players than I am betting that those that were traded for them would even come close to their previous production save Bay.
Payroll savings are a non-sequitor
7. Double amateur draft budget
A) Quality trumps quantity almost every time! They got great value for their money and even though the signed the fewest, they were still in the top 7 of dollars spent. But let's ignore that because it doesn't make your argument look as convincing.
B) Addressed earlier. You're showing a lack of substance if you have to recycle points.
C) Cause != correlation
D)Your opinion.
Jose--is that from "I am the Walrus?" If it is, koo koo ka chu.
Almost forgot, no I'm Spartacus!
No, I'm Spartacus!
Drew, I honestly do not think there are any FAs out there that can make one whit of difference in the overall scheme of things for this club's future. We may be able to sign one year and gone folks, but what does that do for us? They are here for a year, of less if we trade them at the deadline, one year wonders you get marginal prospects in return, if they are prospects, and 2011 we got the same problems. I'd just as soon suck it up and take the beatings until this club has something worthy of building around.
I do agree with your thoughts though on the 2010 ML payroll, somewhere around 30-32 million, hopefully the extra cashola will be spent on the ML draft and Latin America signings, it will be interesting to see if we take the best at #2, or do as we did this year. Hopefully with the extra $$, we can take the best player available and still do some extra spending in the later rounds as we did this year. If we spend 12-14 million on the draft, I got no problems with a 32 million dollar ML payroll. 2010 is not the year of the PBC anyways, maybe 2012-13
So respectfully, expect the worst, hope for the best
This really is groundhog day--not just the same topic but ever the same exact posts--wow
I think most of us smart to understand a letter reading it once :)
@ Arriba: Good call!! Wait! I know that because I wrote everything earlier today...
Are you the Eggman? I am the Walrus!
Signed,
The Plasticene porter with looking glass eyes...
2
Bizzy,
"hopefully the extra cashola will be spent on the ML draft and Latin America signings"
I bet this does not happen.
If they do not acquire any worthwhile players that increase the current 2010 payroll projections above $28M or $29M.....
And if they do not increase their investment signing amateur draft picks or Latin American prospects.....
And the remaining unspent funds do not show up anywhere in the baseball operation that is visible to fans.....
Then in the words of Ricky Ricardo......
You gonna have some 'splainin to do Franky!
I bet he will write us a letter.
How is Hank Blalock an "inexpensive, flawed, 1 yr reclamation project"?
Please explain your logic in making that statement.
Here's a link for career stats for you to reference:
sports.espn.go.com/.../stats
extra MLB Bucco payroll savings = 7 springs already has snow!
Biz--yeah, got to go with NuHo on that one. Remember the separate pockets theory of the FO. According to their theory, money saved from one pocket, like the major league payroll, is not spent or moved to another pocket.
WDI,
Didn't you know...every player that hits a couple dozen HRs and averages 1/18 AB is only good for a year. Maybe two at most!
Drew71 wrote: The holes are narrow and specific
_______________________________________________
I dunno about that. We have one player I think we can be sure about next year: Andrew McCutchen. Beyond that, there's issues: a 3B who didn't hit; a fragile catcher; an unproven 1B; an unknown quantity in the OF; nothing to brag about in the middle infield; inconsistent starting pitching; and not a very good bullpen. That's not to say those problems won't solve themselves: I think LaRoche will hit like we want him to someday; I think Jones can be the real deal; I think we'll soon see why Milledge was once thought to be the greatest thing since sliced bread; I think the starters will improve from last year. But that's just what I think, and I'm no expert on any of this-- and even if I turn out to be 100% right, it's unlikely that all those improvements I'm looking for will happen all at the same time. I guess my point is that I don't see next season as the right time to start laying out the money. There's just too many potential problems to overcome, and paying even the biggest bucks will only (maybe) solve one or two of those problems.
If you think that the only things wrong with the team are 2B, an OF, and a lefty in the bullpen, you may be right. But I don't think we'll know for sure until about June. If I were GM, I'd be awfully reluctant to spend a bunch of money in an attempt to solve just three problems, when there's four or five other potential problems that will cause the team to lose anyway. By the way, the one thing everybody seems to forget is that going out and buying a player doesn't garuntee anything: expensive FA's get hurt and have subpar years, just like everyone else.
I'd rather see some cheap reclamation projects (Khalil Greene and Kelly Johnson I've advocated here before) than a couple big FA signings. Just my opinion.
Wait! Extra $$ to be spent on Latin American signings and the ML Draft!!??
Groundhog Day indeed!
Polyglot-man
3
Jose / Me,
It seems like letters from the Pirate front office apologizing for their shortcomings and pledging better results from their latest and greatest, new and improved strategy make every season since 2005 feel like Groundhogs Day.
Me / You.
=======================
Why does it have to be visible to the fans? If it's being put back into operations, then it's being put back into operations. You don't run a professional sporting franchise (and I assume you have never hence why you are posting on the P-G blog). You have no idea what they're operations truly consist of, hence why you write "visible to the fans" so YOU can see it.
Again I say, if everyone here who dislikes the FO is so concerned with onfield major league results, you would think there'd be more discussion on the players who will be playing (and potentially playing) for this club next year and years to come. YOu know... the ones who will actually be deciding how many Ws/Ls this team has.
Actually though, now that it's been brought up a bazillion times, The projected starting 5 and bullpen are:
1) Bob Nutting
2) Bob Nutting
3) Bob Nutting
4) Bob Nutting
5) Bob Nutting
Bullpen:
Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting, Closer: Bob Nutting
and the Starting 8 position players and bench:
C - Bob Nutting
1B - Bob Nutting
2B - Bob Nutting
3B - Bob Nutting
SS - Bob Nutting
LF - Bob Nutting
CF - Bob Nutting
RF - Bob Nutting
Bench:
Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting, Bob Nutting
Should be a fun year in 2010 rooting for that bunch.
Biz
"2010 is not the year of the PBC anyways, maybe 2012-13"
-------
I have a real problem with this approach as well..... in this case, the FO is telling the fans.... hey, come watch this garbage product we put out on the field for the next 3 years. They'll stink, but in 4 years we may be good.
Could you imagine a pizza shop owner (this example is for Frankie) telling their customers that the pizza is gonna taste like excrement for a few year, but keep coming and spending your money here and some day it will taste better.
Any sports franchise owes it to their tax paying fans to try to win EVERY YEAR. Yes, they can build in addtion to winning now, but screw this "in 4 years crap" We've heard this for 17 years.
Steve,
What does wasting money on a short term reclamation project like Johnson or Greene gain?
Will they make the Pirates a playoff contender?
If not, why bother?
Why waste the money?
I'd rather see it spent on amateur draft picks and Latin American prospects if they would actually do that.
JJ/ Mark and others -
I am seriously interested in your take on the copied letters. I am stunned by your silence.
We can complain forever about these letters, but the cold fact is that the Pirates entire payroll was what, $28 million?
The NY Yankees pay that much just for Sabathia and Teixiera - two players.
The Pirates are trying to win on what amounts to pocket change. I'm still giving Frank C. the benefit of the doubt. I see some hope. More than Littlefield signing Moskos or Van Benschoten as #1 ...
=================================
Yeah, why would we want a 29 year old 1B/3B w/ a career avg. of .269 and 152 Career Homers (avg. of about 21 per season so far) and has been to 2 all-star games?
Save those reclamation projects for the Nats.
===========================
BFD,
I could care less. I care about the players. They could tell me they will never win and will never spend money and they sit back and laugh at the thought of Nutting Hostage getting a hemorrhoid in reading that letter (and letters) that they have put out.
I just don't care. I want to see them win just as much as anyone, except I wanna see the players win, not the FO.
@ Hostage/Me: The same letter being sent helps explain why the PBC was able to cut stuff. Once the letter is written, all one has to do is change the dates and re-send it.
From there to here and here to there, funny things are everywhere.
Polyglot Man
4
Do you actually care to debate the subjects that you broached or are you just spouting nonsense and running off to make sophmoric remarks with BFD & Jose?
If you do, I'd like to hear your response to my post addressing your "concerns".
@ LarryZ: The payroll was significantly higher than that prior to the end of July (albeit still well-bel;ow the league average).
This proves incontrovertibly that while you can lose with a high payroll, you will definitely lose with a really low one. Or something.
Yes, I too would like someone to explain why the annual apology letter sounds so, well, similar?
Jose/et al
5
Why didn't I & Ziskie,
"How is Hank Blalock an "inexpensive, flawed, 1 yr reclamation project"?
You mean besides his .234 / .277 / .459 / .736 performance in 2009?
Or the fact that he has been unable to play a complete season due to injuries since 2006 including in 2009?
Or the fact he can no longer play 3rd due to his shoulder injuries?
Or the 108 K's in only 123 games last season?
Wow. - I misjudged you. - I thought you were knowledgeable baseball fans.
LarryZ,
The fact of the matter is that the Pirates will never ever compete with the Yankees as far as payroll goes because the league is too spineless to adopt true revenue sharing and a salary cap (floor and ceiling).
The Yankees, Red Sox and Cubs (maybe others as well..only know for certain about these three) are legally laundering money to be able to spend where they do. They own the stations that own their broadcasting rights. They (the team) "pays" the tv station (that they own) for the right to broadcast their team's games.
It's taking money out of the right pocket and putting it into the left and raking in any ad revenue that is created by the broadcast as icing on the cake.
The Pirates and most other teams are dealing with some regional affiliate of FSN and guess who keeps the ad revenue from those? It surely isn't the team...it's the network.
StevePegues - reclamation projects.
But if you sign them for 1 year deals, what have we really gained? They do well, they are gone, they do lousy, well, thats why they were reclamation projects.
I do think you are right though, spending money for the 2010 club just isn't worth it. The only exception would be if there are many non-tendered, and it turns into a buyers market, but even then, you only get one year of service and they are outta here.
If the philosophy is to build from within, then thats the way we gotta go, like it or not. 2010 is a rebuilding year, again.
@ Roberto -
got ya...... I guess I hear all the BS and talking and have had enough.... at some point you (the Pirates) need to put up or shut up.....
@ Zisk
"running off to make sophmoric remarks with BFD & Jose?"
It sounds like your cranky....perhaps you are still hungry since Frank wouldn't buy you any pizza?
Pirates say they are very close to finalizing the purchase of a new team for the city of Bradenton.
www.baynews9.com/.../541694.html
McKechnie Field in Bradenton is only used 15 times a year for spring training in March, but that should change in March when the new team come to town.
The Pirates are in the process of purchasing a Cincinnati Reds franchise located in Sarasota. If everything works out according to plan, a new single-A minor league team will be playing 70 games at the field from April through September.
Minor League Baseball officials still have to approve the move, which is expected to happen on Nov. 10. If that happens, then the Pirates plan to reveal the team's new name and introduce the new players to the community the following day.
Ziskie,
I thought your response was pure fantasy land.
Why do you ask?
Do you consider Doumit to be a reclamation project also? His stats are a whole lot worse than Blalock's and he is a whole lot more fragile. Yet, I seem to recall you touting the need for him.
BFD, NuHo, et al,
My response to the similarities in the letter:
The club is still going through the same freakin' process! It's no wonder the letters sound similar...because the job is also!
And if none of you can recognize that there is a whole lot more detail about the process and the steps that are being taken in this current revision...then you three need to start your own "The Pirates FO sux and we will blame every little thing that we can find no matter how inane and petty on them" board and post till your little hearts are content.
NuHo
You are a complete joke. The only thing you add to any discussion is a headache.
You just made this statement.
"We are that bad and unattractive a place for major leaguers to voluntarilty elect to sign with."
How can someone hold this belief and also argue that the team does not spend enough money?
NuHo:
================================================
Really...cause I thought the exact same about yours!
You make unsubstantiated claims backed by nothing more than your own opinion and when someone attempts to get you to attest to the veracity of your claims by making countering arguments, you resort to one of three tactics:
1. Ignore and hope that no one else calls you on the fact that you did
2. Repeat them without any supporting evidence...a second time
3. Respond like you did here
Your lack of willingness to address the subject tells a lot about the validity of your claims.
a shame the yanks can't find anyone to pitch in a major league rotation, and that the game of inches is being decided by inches [and outfield cameras]. I would probably enjoy the series more if the yankees had people vs. hollow stat filled androids as players.
so, I see we now have the Blueprint that controlled the Core, then blew it up for the Group. kind of graphic novel approach historical document. I am glad mortals have been able to touch it at the Gathering.
I just can't get into the analogy of Blueprint, since most real building projects haven't used them for years. blackline plots off an inkjet or laser printer are more common in construction, which of course means the better analogy, instead of The Blueprint would be The Plot...but of course that has FAR too many implications...
"Do you consider Doumit to be a reclamation project also? His stats are a whole lot worse than Blalock's and he is a whole lot more fragile. Yet, I seem to recall you touting the need for him."
I like Doumit because I am a Pirate fan but the fact of the matter is, he has yet to establish himself as an effective major leaguer so IMO he has to stake his claim before he can "reclaim" anything.
Blalock once was an effective everyday player. Come the 2010 season it will have been 4 years since he was.
Doumit and Blaclock are a horrible comparison. - They are at completely different stages of their respective careers.
C'mon, you need to do better than this otherwise I will not waste my time on imbecilic topics such as this.....
It appears that some one is posting under duel id's.....
DK - would you like to reveal who NuttingHostagesHostage is?
Couple of things from my perspective..
1. The blueprint was an interesting marketing piece. But just a marketing piece.
2. Even if I go along with 'the blueprint' and accept that theirs is the best approach. The thing that makes the blueprint either successful or unsuccessful, comes down to management ability to evaluate talent. If they aren't drafting the right players, signing the right Latin American players, trading for the right players, then the plan could end up a collosal failure. I mean, it's good to have structure, but at the end of the day if Huntington can't evaluate talent, then this team is going nowhere.
3. Payroll - I understand MarkinD's comments about payroll/revenue sharing, but I still believe that this market could be so much more for the team, if they had a product to support. I think Pittsburgh is a big enough sports town to fully support a competitive team. Salary cap's aside - it's amazing how much support the Steelers and Penguins get - continual sell outs, and a TV revenue gem (both locally and nationally). If we had a fanbase that supported the Pirates in this way, regularly sell out PNC park, and have better TV ratings, it would equate to a lot more revenue.
4. People on this blog often make statements against spending money, (like they shouldn't spend money on a Blalock because that's not enough to make the team competitive). I don't understand why anyone would rally for the team saving money on payroll. Do you believe that the team is 'banking' the difference between 32 mil (or whatever it is), and 55 mil, and will use it in the future? I'm all for them following a plan, but I'm also spending a fair amount of money on season tickets, and it's not like there's some relationship between my seat price and the teams payroll. I don't get a dividend if they don't spend money on fielding a competitive team. Especially with the current payroll level of the major league team. They can still support every initiative in their blueprint and increase payroll - so it's not like you're trading one for the other. The same goes to overpaying for players. The Pirates, due to a history of being a laughingstock, have to overpay, so we just need to accept that and not worry about it, it's not our money, and we have no say in how it gets spent anyhow.
Radio wave, Yes the radio broadcasts fall under the jurisdiction of our next gathering guest.
@ Zisk: Sophomoric remarks?? Thank you! I was thinking of them as almost as juvenile as all of the secret doppleganger remarks. Sophomoric is actually a step up.
Jose/et al, etc
6
DK only selectively enforces the Post Gazette's blog guidelines.
sside67 -
completely agree with point # 4...very well said....be ready to get crushed by others though
I read that Johnny Damon is pretty much gone from the NYY after this season. He would be a real nice pickup for the Bucs. A veteran, proven player that could be a nice 1-2 year deal for a good price, maybe $5-6 million? Our right field options suck. We definitely definitely need a proven veteran for 2010.
Damon has really impressed me this year.
Larry,
Damon will be 36 years old next season.
How does spending $5M or $6M on a 36 year old outfielder make any sense for a club in the initial stages of a complete and total rebuilding process and several years away from being competitive?
I agree Damon may still have a few productive years left, but he is better suited plugging an OF hole for a competitive club than just being a rent-a-player for a rebuilding club.
Besides, I'd have to think Damon will have higher aspirations than to sign with the lowly Nuttings.
Larry -
Could you imagine from Damon's perspective going from the Yankees to the Bucs....wow!
It depends, a high school soph is almost always juvenile but a college soph is lesss likely to be so. :)
BFD - yeah, true, but getting someone with that kind of playoff and world series experience would be invaluable. Different than signing a washed up a-hole like Hinske, etc. (I hope you're reading this Eric...what a jerk...)
Hey, Damon played for Kansas City before joinging Boston and New York, so he knows losing.
I don't know. Maybe we could entice him.
BFD
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I could not agree more, I buy tickets too see professional baseball, I was greatly disappointed the last two months of the season when we went into exhibition mode, even though I knew what was going on. It still was not pretty.
I with you on this one.
They certainly can build and continue to build while winning at the same time.
What message does it send to the fans that you are trying to sell tickets to if you say we don't plan on winning until 2012-2015, they are liable to tell the Pirates, see you in 1012, maby.
I understand there to be some potential in the farm system at second base. To me, a two-year fix by a talented, veteran second baseman makes sense, while the people being "raised" on the farm get ready (are you reading this Shelby Ford? No more steps back, you hear?)
Pirates payroll is $32 million, not $28. Not a big difference, but if you want to give the $4 million to me, I'd take it with a smile.
I still have faith the Yankees will pull it out! I hope last night's win only makes their overall loss of a back to back pennant more painful for Phillies fans.
JAL,
"a high school soph is almost always juvenile"
Won't psost all the exceptions but please do some research before posting blanket statements. That is classical logic--If someone says all or every and there is one counter example the claim falls. Claim data warrant--in this case the data fails to support the claim. That is not nit-picking.
POH,
"Pirates payroll is $32 million, not $28."
DK and other journalists have reported it is at $28M.
Can you produce documented proof to your claim of $32M?
"They certainly can build and continue to build while winning at the same time. "
Leadoff,
I don't think it's near that simple. If we had tried to win with Nady, Bay, McLouth, etc...., you're potentially slowing down the development of the minors. We received lots of players with plenty of service time in all of these trades. I also think it's pretty apparent that without a strong minor league system, we won't win anyways.
Now after this many years, I don't have a problem with the thinking that says the org owed it to the fans to try and win anyways. Either way is not a good answer really.
Hostage
I have worked with many high school students and I was one once up upon a time so i did practical research :)
I read that Johnny Damon is pretty much gone from the NYY after this season. He would be a real nice pickup for the Bucs. A veteran, proven player that could be a nice 1-2 year deal for a good price, maybe $5-6 million? Our right field options suck. We definitely definitely need a proven veteran for 2010
________________________________
I like the ideal of Damon, I have no problem with everyday players that are 1-2 year players for us.
Our farm is basically 2 years away from producing and I am not willing to lose until they get here. I really don't care about whether someone likes coming here or not, that is not for me to decide, I have a feeling money might have more to do with acquiring players than anything else.
21
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We already have a strong minor league system and it will get even stronger with this years draft.
I am talking about where we are at now, not when we had to make the trades to get where we are.
Our budget is somewhere around 28-32mil depending on who you talk to. Our budget was close to 50mil last year and we did not end up spending near that much, so I don't see any reason why we can't go out and fill a few obvious holes to make this years team a better team and give them a better chance to win.
You can do this without hindering any of our building plans.
Why is that wrong?
Also, my post was a qualified statement, not a blanket statement :)
Well, Hostage, I really hate to do this, because I have a pretty good guess of what the responses are going to be.
At the gathering, Mr. Coonelly was told Pirate Payroll is $28 million. He said "Payroll is $32 million."
With respect to the reporters, they are not the president of the Pirates, so I'm thinking he has the more informed answer.
Did I ask him to break it down? No.
Did I ask for a spread sheet? No.
Expert, texpert, choking smokers don't you think the joker laughs at you?
I'd post something optimistic, but it wouldn't dent the gloom.
Just one thing -- sside67, there is indeed a correlation between payroll and seat prices -- have you seen what the Yankees charge or compared seat prices with other clubs?
Probably the reason people talk about whether to spend money or not on some specific player has to do with allocation of scarce resources -- I have no objection to spending per se, I think the Bucs have about $20 mil or so they could part with this year, but I oppose stop gaps. They have guys now in the minors who will either be with the club for awhile, or deserve a chance -- bringing someone in in front of those guys as a place holder would jsut be foolish. They also have a few positions that need help, getting someone competent in there on a longer term contract would be worth doing.
@ JAL: You mean I was supposed to stop being juvenile after a certain point? Missed that memo!
I really love these supportive payroll notes like spending $28 million is some sort of virtue and that getting an FA or two will give the team a "chance" to win.
Our new Motto: "The Pittsburgh Pirates: We have a chance to win."
Jose/Sybil
7
"B" old buddy
In your response to sside you stated you agreed with his point #4.
Did you read the whole thing or did you stop halfway through because at the end it said:
The Pirates, due to a history of being a laughingstock, have to overpay, so we just need to accept that and not worry about it, it's not our money, and we have no say in how it gets spent anyhow.
So, now you have shot yourself in the foot so to speak, because you are on record as being in "complete agreement with point #4". You are now officially unable to say that the Pirates should do anything because it is not your money *wink*
Stay tuned folks after these messages we will continue with the "Bob Nutting is an _____ show
Later on the PBC network: the continuing saga of who is more right NuHo ,or In Zisk we Trust.
And just out of curiosity, how much more would you be willing to pay, and how many more games would you go to if the Bucs were to increase their payroll?
@JHadar..
I welcome the day the Pirates can sell out and raise my ticket prices, because it could only be done in an environment of a winning and competitive franchise - and due to demand for tickets exceeding supply. As a Pirate fan, if we were a playoff team, I would gladly pay more for my seats. (Pens games cost me a fortune comparatively, but the product is unbelievable)
I am talking, though, about the here and now. While I'm not a walking bibliography of quotes, it seems that the team could spend in the 50-55 mil range in their current budget (that accounts for current ticket prices). If they only spend 40, whom here benefits.
If you are talking about blocking a players progress, then thats a different discussion. However, other than Alvarez, who has a power bat in the minors that could be blocked (or middle infield for that matter)?
Doesn't seem like anyone, Jeff Clement hasn't shown he can get it done in Indy, much less deserve a place on the MLB roster, and all the other OF don't have the power we need. Middle Infield? (nothing there - nobody's going to be blocked at SS or 2B) Relief pitchers - nobody's ever been blocked there..
<< I want to see them win just as much as anyone, except I wanna see the players win, not the FO. >>
That is the best thing I have read on this blog in months. Standing ovation for that one!
On my reclamation projects idea:
No, they won't make them playoff contenders, barring some aberration (like Greene hitting 200 HR, and Johnson becoming a pitcher and throwing 20 perfect games). But it's a cheap risk you take to make the team better. And make no mistake: I only support the idea if the guys are cheap. Hank Blalock won't come cheap.
There's always the thought that a contender will want a one or more of the reclamation guys and give up some good prospects at the trading deadline. But Biz does have a point about what happens if they do real well. I guess you're stuck with a problem then, the answer to which depends largely on what you think you have in the farm system. Still, I think the reward outweighs the risk in this case, but obviously reasonable minds can disagree about it.
Good morning all. I'll try again today, but I already see that Hos has his copy and paste in full opperation. Look forward to reading the FC latter again tomorow Hos.
Filling the now more limited holes at the ML level should not disturb the blue print or master plan or whatever you want to call it. By the way, I looked forward to reading the entire blue print but it seems imposable. The small print was illegable and when magnafied it was equally illegable.
The consencous seems to be that a 2B, RF, and a couple of LH relievers should at least put the club on the right track to start the 2010 seasion. Money should not be a problem in solving these problems, so why not seek the impact solutions rather then the easiest.
I believe that the system is on the right track enough that trading a couple prospects to fill these holes will not spoil the plan. If anything, I think that more loosing at the ML level could hurt what future core that is already there.
If Uggla can be had for a coupls of prospects and he is a impact solution to for the ML club then go for if. I think if the Marlins are considering nontendering Hermedia then what is to keep them from throwing him in for sweetning the pot.
These are two impact solutions for two stated holes at the ML level for the price of what? Grossman, Gorkys, Marte? Players like these arn't coming here through free agency. I believe that with the future OF of AMac, Milledge, and Tabada these prospects are expendable anyway. Plus you fill your holes with impact solutions.
The future core playrers will remember this when it comes contract time. The Pirates didn't let us flapping in the wind when we needed help. The price is not that high.
@jhadar..
Not a dime for increasing payroll.
It's the product on the field that matters. Give me a winning record (for more than one year) and you can charge me $10 more a game ($24 sec 119 seats increase to $34)
If you put me in the playoffs 2 times in 5 years and those seats could go for $50.
They can't charge more for tickets unless demand goes up. If they don't have increase demand to see the product, then basic economics would show that attendance would go down as pricing went up.
Terr
I think you hit the nail right on the head!
@terrbear:
I'm not as high on Uggla as some are. I think he'd cost too much in prospects to get. And his defense isn't particularly good at 2B and he doesn't play another position that I'm aware of. Sure, he's a good hitter overall and a really good offensive player for a 2B, but I dunno...
I guess if 2B was THE one big problem to solve to push the team into world series contention, then Uggla would be worth it. But for now, I'd pass.
terrbear -
>>...so why not seek the impact solutions rather then the easiest. <<
I agree.
@Why Didn't I...I too care about the players winning, not the FO. I couldn't have stated that any bette than you did. Thank you. :-)
Good day inmates near and far.
I thought Drew strted a good conversation that deserved an equal effort/thought in response. I was hopeful that this wouldn't echo yesterday, but now that looks like where we're headed. Too bad.
POH: I agree with your thought on 2b.
JJ: Thanks for the gathering feedback.
Mr. Zisk, I thought you were constructive in your posts.
Jose: I know you can rise well above what you have given us today, I would really appreciate something better.
New Ho: How bizzare is it that you kept those past letters? All of them, including Fc's are corporate speak/marketing, and not worth keeping.
No letter of that type will affect my decision to by or not buy tickets. Also I was under the impression that the payroll could go as low as $24m.
You have to spend money to make money. But in my very first post on this blog, I asked the question; If the pirates signed a high priced Fa, and the out of pocket costs to go to a game increased $5-$10, would Pirates fans be willing to pay the increase? I still wonder about that today.
And now to some real baseball:
Tomorrow night's game, and a possible game 7 are very interesting.
Pettit may not be effective on 3 days rest. Pedro has to go at least into the 6th to protect the Phils pen. If a game 7, I would suspect the Phils will do a bullpen by committee. Cliff Lee has already said he is good for sixty pitches. What does everyone think.
Mr. Hadar, smell the roses yet?
Steve
Sure, he's a good hitter overall and a really good offensive player for a 2B, but I dunno...
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The pros of getting Uggla are this; He is a power hitter, what did Utley do for the Phils yesterday. We do not have enough power in the system and only one possible power bat on the way.
He is only 27, he can be a player they can keep if they want to or trade when the time comes for talented players.
The Cons:
He is arbitration eligible for the next two years, then a FA.
He is not a good defensive 2nd basemen.
It probably is going to take 6-8mil in salary this year.
In Summation:
We could have Jones, Uggla and Alvarez in the 3-5 holes in about a half a year. With McCutcheon and Milledge ahead of them and Andy LaRoach or Doumit in the six hole, we go from a weak hitting lineup to one with a lot of potential with one move.
What is wrong with that?
Why don't we just move Andy LaRoche to 2B and let Pedro Alvarez serve his AAA time in Pittsburgh with the Bucs at 3B.
Leave the legend in RF and sign a utility IF and Blalock/Clements platoon at 1B. Yes, the corners would be risky but Alvarez would have a year to get acclimated and we could see if Clements can do anything. Let Veal start.
What's the worse that could happen? The Bucs lose 100+ games but gain valuable experience/knowledge on some talent and can see if the Legend was a one-shot wonder. They are not going to be very good next year anyway. Upside outweighs downside.
Extra money could be invested in 2011 to make the Pirates legitimate wildcard prospects even with a cheap payroll.
IMO, when we took the route of deconstructing a lot of the Major League talent we had, it should be pretty obvious, that this coming season is not the target date for success. Success on the field is not the number one priority in 2010 for this club.
Steve P, maybe taking a flyer on some of the guys out there could work if you got them for one and a team option, and there may be bargains out there with the economy.
But trading our depth? No thanks. I'm not sure we have as much as some may think. We got maybes, not sure prospects. There is no such animal. We took quantity in the trades, hoping to catch lightening in a bottle.
Ugglia? Give up what talent you have in the minors, overpay for two years for the guy and then he walks, right about the time that the "blueprint" may be coming together.
Any move this club makes to improve in 2010, IMO of course, takes away from the plan and if done, would be counterproductive, done to appease us lunatics, I don't want us lunatics running the DVD player in the rec room, much less the PBC.
Thats why I keep saying, expect and hope
No memo friend--some people are still juvenile at age 80 :)
Leadoff -
I almost crapped in my pants reading your post about us being in agreement :)
Indiana my pal -
You are correct, it is not my money Nutting is pocketing....... I have not contributed a dime (other than tax money which unfortunatley I have little say in how it is spent) to his coffers since the year I realized what a fraud him and his operation was back in 2001
WHERE'S THE PIZZA FRANK?
The Buccs don't have to be outstanding at 2B. If Uggla is average defensivly and hits better then average for the position then I think they cancle each other out.
Plus, I do this deal only if it includes a Hermedia that they are going to nontender anyway. Makes the Marlins think they are getting something out of him.
Every one seems hung up on a supperb middle defensivly. Put a couple bats at those positions and see how the order changes. Remember the Bucs are can fill the holes they have in the field at the same time they are filling the holes at the 2 through 5 spots in the order.
"expect and hope"
--------
I EXPECT this team to be pathetic for many years to come and HOPE I seeing a winning season before I die.
Johnny
Te club has already approached Andy about moving to 2nd so the idea is being considered.
Must have been the pizza you have been eating.
I might be called an optimist by some on this blog site, but the one thing I do not condone is losing when you don't have to lose, if they do nothing, then they are sending a clear message that they don't care about winning.
I don't want to hear about some mythical time in the future that they are planning on winning like it is light bulb that they are going to turn on. I know better. If I am the GM of this team, you can bet I am going to win and do very little to almost nothing to stop the building process of this team.
This is the way I see it for next year --
OF - would be silly to bring in a FA of anything less than all-star quality, which is not where I would spend my money. McCutcheon's a lock, Milledge is worth a look, and Tabata is the leading candidate. Moss and Pearce pretty well played themselves out of contention. Young's fielding is not good, but like him as a bat off the bench.
C -- Doumit's job to lose -- Diaz and Jaramillo proved they could play. I liked Diaz a little better, but thought it was close. Sanchez in the ings.
1B -- Jones -- need to find out if he's the real deal.
2B -- LaRoche -- if he's going to to make the switch, start with Day 1 of ST.
SS -- I like Cedeno, but here's one place I'd spend some of that extra payroll money -- would go as far as 3 years while we try to build from within.
3B -- A stop gap here until Alvarez is ready -- Walker? I don't know, he's young and athletic but could hit better. A tryout right now could relegate him to a utility role.
SP -- Ohlendorf, Duke, Maholm, Morton -- at least to start the year. Could spend some money here if the opportunity presents itself. Hart, Ascaino, Dumatrait could also compete, but need to be healthy -- maybe long relievers. Veal goes to the Indy for more seasoning.
Closer-- Hanrahan, please. I know there's always hope that Capps will return to form, but in my mind right now he's on the auction block.
RP -- A couple lefties please. Also Meek if he's healthy again, Chavez, and Jackson to go along with the long relievers.
Bench -- Young, definitely. I'd let Vazquez go, and I can't see putting Clement on the bench if he's healthy. Not Bixler or Cruz either. Cedeno if we get a shortstop. The winner of Moss vs Pearce. Diaz, but as before Jaramillo is OK, too. That leaves a place for an outfielder, and if you're going to do that, bring in a guy who will push Milledge and Tabata.
So when it comes down to it -- We have about $20-25 million, need a shortstop, 2 left handed relievers, an outfielder who could either start or be the first guy off the bench, and possibly a starting pitcher.
All of this changes if there are all-star quality guys available at bargain prices due to the strange economy. But I still believe that there is enough raw talent on this team, that anything could happen.
ants marching====================
JH
SP -- Ohlendorf, Duke, Maholm, Morton -- at least to start the year. Could spend some money here if the
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You left out Dan McCutcheon, he actually can throw strikes.
I agree with you about the raw talent.
@ Radio: A fair request, good sir! I will see what I can do to honor same.
8
I don't understand why people in favor of the blue print (and I am one of them) think that it has to be done at the expense of the ML club. Both can be nursed back to health at the same time. Most the emphasis so far has been on the minors, but both can be taken care of at the same time.
I believe that the minors are in much better shape then they were 3 years ago, and they can help the ML club in more ways then just advancing.
I can't beleive that I'm starting to like the Uggla idea at 2nd.
Spend the $$ even if it's a bit more that is comfortable. If he doesn't perform - arbitration is easy. If he preforms - pay him or let him go and get a draft pick. Don't Rush Pedro. You can always execute a trade if things get too crowded (although you may have to eat some of the extra $$). Crowded is a problem we are not familiar with here lately. I like AMac in the 3 slot as he continues to develop.....
The who's on firsat and elsewhere quetion was asked and answered at the gathering and posted on the blog.
The locks as of todat are clutch, ryan, andy in the field and ollie and juke and paul with the ball and that is about it.
JJ
What is a "lock as of today"?
Is that one of those - "If the season started today" things?
It's kinda like the annual letters, isn't it?