Post-Gazette beat writers Dejan Kovacevic and Chuck Finder blog about the Pittsburgh Baseball Club.
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FIRSTIES?
TRICK OR TREAT
maybe a new promo for pirates 2010? watch the candy they are giving out at certain bedside tables at the asylum....
HEAR YE HEAR YE
Next gathering Special Guest
Lou DePaoli
Executive Vice president and Director of Media Marketing
Date: December 5th.
Complete information to follow
BFD - You can change your name field by clicking on the edit button on the upper right. It's under profile options. I hate to think I've given you that power... :-)
I don't know if this has been noted, but Perrotto is reporting on insidepittsburghsports.com that these players on on the Pirates' free agency radar...
infielders: hank blalock, andy tracy, bobby crosby, khalil greene, felipe lopez
outfielders: rick ankiel, rocco baldelli
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Basically, every current replacement level player who used to be a 2-4 WAR player several years back.
And then there's Felipe Lopez, who had a great year. I'm not sure why he's on this list. Not sure what Andy Tracy is doing on it either.
Anyway, all the rest are of the buy extremely low, and hope you catch a shooting star you can flip when your internal option matures.
Of the realistic ones, Blalock and Ankiel I think are the most intriguing, however, if Rocco Baldelli is actually healthy, he might be a very good one to take a flyer on.
I don't know if this was seen, but Giants sign Freddy Sanchez to a 2 year $12M deal.
In related news, Juan Uribe is going to test free agency. Uribe is intriguing because he can actually play 3B, 2B or decent SS.
If the Pirates were to look at him, that could fit in well with the possible musical chairs in the infield. He could start at 2B and then move to short when Alvarez arrives.
Of course, this would no fit in with a buy low and pray attitude. It would be more a buy high and pray he doesn't regress attitude, so it's doubtful to happen.
BFD, was that a trick question to possibly hide that you are the double dipper? own up.
BFD RE: Carlos, not true, my glass is always more than half full.
Your funny man stuff aside, please be specific to your comment about him, as not sure what you are talking about?
All I did was copy what Chuck wrote to point out the fellow has done some homework and th e fact that he is younger than perry who went over the hill so he may just be a bit on the leaner side.
Morning Links
Giants sign Freddy Sanchez to two-year, $12 million deal
www.mercurynews.com/.../ci_13681671
Garcia to replace former infield guru Hill
www.post-gazette.com/.../1009773-63.stm
M's Wilson named top defensive shortstop in baseball
blog.seattlepi.com/.../183704.asp
THE OFFICIALLY UNOFFICIAL PBC BLOGS AND MLB LINKS:
Bucs Dugout--Pirates Claim Justin Thomas From Mariners
www.bucsdugout.com/.../pirates-claim-justin-thomas-from
Raise The Jolly Roger--Giants Re-sign Freddy
raisethejollyroger.com/.../giants-re-sign-freddy
The Green Weenie-Jarek Cunningham
oldbucs.blogspot.com/.../jarek-cunningham.html
The Green Weenie--The latest
oldbucs.blogspot.com/.../latest.html
PBC Homepage-Minor League look: Class A Lynchburg
pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/.../article.jsp
MLB transactions
www.cbssports.com/.../transactions
Bucco Fans--Pittsburgh Pirates Top 50 Prospects: 26 - Brooks Pounders
www.buccofans.com/.../pittsburgh-pirates-top-50-prospects-26.html
Bucco Fans Wiki--Links to many lists and data like Rule 5 eligible Pirates
buccofans.wikispaces.com
Winter League Stats of Pirate Players
mlb.mlb.com/.../org.jsp
As the Asylum Turns.....
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Nov. 2008 - Pirates sign Perry Hill:
PBC Asylum: "What a great hire by Neal, Hill is the best infield coach in baseball. This is a huge step in the right direction".
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September 2009: It's reported by several sources Hill will not be back because he disagrees with the PBC FO philosophies:
PBC Asylum: "Well it's a shame Hill is leaving, but if he really wants to spend time with his family, who can blame him. Hopefully Neal can convince him to stay. This is just negotiating."
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October 2009: Hill is quoted in the Post Gazette, "I want to coach, just not in Pittsburgh":
PBC Asylum: "I never liked that greedy little jerk Perry Hill anyway. He is a clubhouse cancer, good riddance, we are better off without him. We were losing with him anyway."
------------------------------------------------------------------
Oct 2009: Carlos Garcia is hired to replace Hill as first base and infield coach:
PBC Asylum: "What a great hire by Neal, Garcia will do a great job".
Mark - Thanks for the info.... i will try to only use it for good...not evil
JJ - I was refering to the post which contained
"seems to me that we may have a much younger more energetic, lots more hungry version of Perry gone over the hill".
I just question some of your posts, because you never seem to be on the other side of everything is great with this FO.
Morning mates, good tidings
Thanks for the link on JWilson, JAL, interesting reading.
MarkinDallas notes that Perrotto says we're interested in Blalock, isn't he a third baseman?
Hoss, that may have been your finest post ever.
I called my brother and read it to him over the phone.
He really enjoys your work as I do.
IT'S A CULTURE OF WINNING!
Srsly.
BFD, Well, what part of that is not true? He is younger and did take the job and is working which translates to more potential energy to be used tis year on the diamond added to the fact that he has not alluded to the fact that he prefers to keep his teaching to established all stars. If you were to check the archives you would see that I posted over and over again that i thought perry would have eliminted all the personal reasons to not coach again early on and that the longer the talks went the more likely he would sign on again.
He did not, so therefore, I for sure must be dissapointed that they did not sign him. I allow you a certain high level of logic to figure i must not be happy with that.
My glass being almost full all the time combined with my allowing you that high level of logic allows me to not empty said glass.
I posted several times I wished we would begin to manage to win. I think maybe you expect me to post in the same crybaby m,anner as some others who all they do is whine whine whine.
Plain commen sense logic says anything I post in favor of that does not happen I then am not in favor of what did happen !
Ask anyone at the gatheriong who asked the toughest question, me. That exchnge was one of the off the record exchanges that we have.
Contrary, what do you ever post in support of anything the FO does?
Biz, he has mostly played third but ahs played every other infield position
Does anyone else have problem with the link to the top 50 prospects? just about shuts my computer down.
Thanks JJ, I went to MLBTradeRumors to check on him, whats the big deal with this guy? Have heard/seen his name several times here, and we have the Legend at first, much depth at third
I see nothing
Interesting recap of the Perry Hill saga by NutHo.
The only thing that would have made it more hilarious if he would have included his posts to the blog saying it was the worst reflection on the FO and may be the end of the world.
Mr. Demery,
Thank you sir.
I find the people here in the Asylum to be very, very nice people, but in a way much like a kitten loyally following the beam of a flashlight on the carpet. - They basically believe what their master, FC, tells them to believe.
Whoda thunk that free pizza could be such a powerful mind control method?
markinD-
I am not jazzed about any of those players and I hope the FO isn't seriously considering any of these retreads as a way to up our power or productivity at the plate. blalock with a .240BA 2009 especially does not seem to be a better risk than assuming moss or pearce or clement would improve allowing jones at 1B. I would hope we never bring an HGH cloud of suspicion player here- I would really drop my nanothread of optimism and support if they did. certainly some better leather there.
Blalock, Baldelli, and Green = Casey, Randa, and Burnitz.
But worse.
By all means, let's do that again because it worked out so well the first time.
This front office is doing things so much differently compared to the last front office.
Boo!
whadya all think of my halloween costume??
i know, never looked better.
Hos -
Green: I agree
Baldelli: I agree (he belongs on a GOOD team that can bury him on bench and take chance that he might recapture old form and health, but not COUNT on him as a starter as a bad team would have to.)
Blalock: Not so fast my friend. Think about it. He can HIT...and has some power. So he can't play 3rd anymore. We don't NEED 3rd. Put him at 1st, move Legend to outfield, you now have a respectable OF (Clutch-Jones-Milledge) plus a 20 HR guy at 1st. I can live with that. Milledge has the tools to be a good OF once he learns better "route-running", so the Clutch-Milledge combo can cover for some of Legend's D limitations. Traditional baseball thinking is that a converted 3Bman would find 1B fairly easy to pick up and wouldn't fall in category of "experiment".
Blalock, Baldelli, Green
I don't like any of these guys, we have players as good as they are now. One or two of them might be good bench players, but if hitting was our problem last year, I don't see any saviors here.
Milledge has the tools to be a good OF once he learns better "route-running",
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He doesn't IMO need to learn better route running, they need to stop having him play half the outfield in a rather large outfield.
His route running is actually simple, it mainly consists of running east and west now, not a lot of north and south, that is Cutch's job.
Leady: His route running is actually simple, it mainly consists of running east and west now, not a lot of north and south, that is Cutch's job.
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Maybe. either thru route training, or as you describe different OF alignment and assignments, bottom line is that we think he's 'capable of being capable', or more than capable, in OF. Many good teams hide a weaker D in one OF spot, and if we're hiding Legend...well, think of Teddy L from 1970 Phillies. And Legend is now, today, a better OFer than that load. Legend is not TERRIBLE. He's a far cry better than DY at 2nd...in fact i think he's better than DY at OF.
My overall point is that you would then have, between all 3 OFers and 1B four guys who can hit 15-25 HRs/year (I'm whittling Jonesy down a bit from his 09 pace), which means no HUGE threat but consistent power possibility up-down lineup. LaRoche showed power emerging last 2 mos...lets say 12 from him, 12 from a healthy Doumit, the open Qs are middle infield. And once Pedro arrives, we have our serious bopper in the middle of the lineup.
I'm just sayin'....not 1927 (or 2009) Yankees, but with Blalock at 1st and Jones in OF, they've met ONE of my criteria for offseason moves (find outfielder OR 1B with some pop).
Not getting too excited. Their dumpster diving L reliever from yesterday does NOT, by itself, solve our L relief (no problem with move...BIG problem if it's the only one). And middle infield is a quagmire. But still...if Blalock at 1st, one down and two to go.
Big if...Blalock (or PBC) may end up having no mutual interest.
Drew,
Get past the name of "Blalock". - That guy hasn't been around for 3 or 4 years.
The current Blalock cannot stay healthy for an entire season, strikes out too much, and has a lousy OBP.
Despite those shortcomings he may be better than what we have, but he isn't worth the money it would take to sign him.
The PBC organization needs to get beyond throwing away money on highly flawed players like Blalock. - It's a waste of money that should go to signing more than 23 draft picks or Latin American prospects like Sano.
Just say no to Blalock.
Sounds like there's going to be a lot of non-tendered folks this winter, I'm sure we're going to the Philenes bargain basement and see if we can pick up a few leftovers.
Just curious and not to start any wars, does anyone know what the PBC offered Freddy prior to trading him? I know folks on this blog were talking about the 2 yrs - 12 million he signed for.
I have a real "outside the box" idea to get power in the lineup...
Hideki Matsui as the starting 1B next year.
He is about to be a FO and has expressed a desire to play the field again instead of just being a DH. He has said that he wants to either play LF or 1B.
He's older (35) so he shouldn't require the $13M he made the last 4 years and has shown considerable power ~25 HRs when he has gotten over 500 ABs.
He would bring experience, knowledge of what it takes to win and pop to a lineup that very much needs it. It also allows Jones to play in RF every day and Clements another year at Indy to get comfortable with playing 1B.
PS...i used to LOVE the Oriole's 1970s lineup...only 1 big bopper - and not by far the biggest bopper in baseball - and 6-7 OTHER guys who could hit 18-25 HRs. SOME power EVERYWHERE rather than all concentrated in 1-2 hitters. No way to pitch around, and made Weaver's "play for the 3 run HR" strategy much more achieveable because the singles AND the bop could come from almost anywhere in lineup.
i know, i know, we're a long way from that. But just sayin'...it's my favorite type of offensive strategy...and easier to draft, develop and find 18+ HR guys than 30-40 HR guys.
Zisk,
That's a great idea.
Let's have two guys playing positions that are not their best.
Matsui is a horrible idea and total waste of money.
Drew
I'll give in on Blalock at first, just not 3rd, they would be better than they are now for sure. But an outfielder that hits 280 and 25 Home runs and Jones at 1st base his natural position is more of what I am looking at.
I agree the middle infield is bad and has to be addressed. I don't see any long term solutions in FA, and our infield prospects are at class A with no guarantees of how good they are going to be in 2 years.
I can only see one way to fix the middle infield and that is with trades.
Umm...didn't Baldellie turn the Pirates down to play for the BoSox?
I like Crosby. He's played every position on the infield, but mostly at SS for Oakland. But with Eric Chavez still a ? again next season, can Oakland afford to lose Crosby?
Biz--I think it was 2 years at $10 mil and it was at the point he still had a decent shot at guaranteeing $8.5 for one year. Of course, he's old, fat and lazy. Sorry, my bad, that was Perry Hill. ;-)
Zisk
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last I heard, he wanted to go to Seattle, He might want to play a regular position, but his knees are bad, when your knees get bad and you have the grind of playing every day (don't forget we have JR, when to use players, not his strong point) hitting may change.
Hos - your point is valid, but i'm not quite there with you on Blalock at 1B (lower injury potential). We'll see.
So i have a bigger Q for you.
Yesterday we both said we wanted to find a way to measure offseason moves. I'm still interested. You didn't like my grading scale, or more likely my priorities. As Ross Perot said, I'm all ears...willing to consider any other method of measurement. Seriously, you have any ideas?
I have another very complex one, which i havent posted, that has too much discretion to it...will wait to hear your thoughts first. If you can come up with something, i'll trash my other idea.
DMac
IMO, Crosby is more of what we already have, I would rather upgrade, after all did we not get rid of our average players, why replace them with average players?
CONGRATS TO FREDDY, GLAD IT WORKED OUT
Can someone please tell me how the meeting with Coonelly went, and also how did the asylum have the ability to set up that meeting, Gosh I wish i could have made it, please someone tell me how it went and what was the toughest question...______________________________________
On a side note, rooting for a team that actually wins like my DALLAS COWBOYS takes away alot of pain from the last MLB CAMPAIGN BY MY BELOVED BUCS...
NuHo,
You've really become great at criticizing and condemning. You've made it into an art form.
There is another option that you should try sometime....instead of being part of the problem (whining, complaining and crying "woah is me" at every corner) you could offer up some suggestions and attempt to be part of the solution.
I think that the 20 runs a year that his defense would cost the team would be more than made up for by the 40 more runs that his bat would be able to produce over our current option (Pearce) if Legend is back in the outfield.
i agree Leady and Hossy re: Matsui. For both his as well as our reasons, doesnt look like a fit to me.
...and i agree that Legend at 1st and another OF is better than reverse, but i can certainly live with the reverse if we get a better batter that way.
Thanks, Arriba
Does Clements have an option left? I can never remember. Once you are on the 40 man, you can only be sent down 3 years, I think his first year Seattle put him on the roster, much as the Bosox did with Hansen and we had to do with Pedro.
Its going to be real interesting as to who we lose due to no spot on the 25, maybe there will be more scholarships offered this year?
We've kicked around FA names, but IMO after maybe Holliday, Bay and Lackey, its slim pickings as far as impact guys go.
I don't have a problem with them 'renting' some proven major leaguers for a year or two. ( not K. Greene-- too many issues).
But where I want them to improve is scouting these players. Don't make the same scouting errors that were made when they signed Randa and Burnitz.
Nutho, who bought you free pizza that has had such powerful mind control on you? Always negative and attacking.
Drew- I've seen you. You are not all ears...but close. Does your wife know you're posting her picture on the internets...especially here?
...one more OF thought. I'd rather them get a younger (not young, just not 35ish) OF and sign for 2 or even 3 years who's solid but maybe no serious upside, than try another reclamation project who has a 10% chance of 'lightning in a bottle' (i really HATE that expression...sounds to me like a way to excuse a bad move) and more likely is Burnitz.
Same with 2nd...prefer a 2-3 year contract with a solid 2B. No high upside, but not a career backup or career wash-up.
Now, if you want to disagree with that strategy, go for it big boys, but i DON'T want to hear about BLOCKING. Remember one of my tee-shirts: It's not blocking, it's options. NO SUCH THING as blocking. Not on a bad team. And not when a certain tool called TRADING (eventual) EXCESS TALENT exists. i know, i know...it's been 17 years since this team had excess talent at ANY position and you forget what it's like. But i'm WARNING you...DON'T GET ME STARTED on my no-such-thing-as-blocking rant or i'll sick mrs drew on you....and you don't want THAT. TRUST me. After 68 years of marriage (and 3 of the best years of my life...ba-dum-bum), you don't want THAT.
dayle
The Coonelly meeting was discussed the day it happened and the day after so just take the wayback machine back.
TC - she saw the pic...she didn't have a problem. But wait until i show her what i said in my LAST post! hooo-boy, i'm in TROUBLE.
<< Drew Ears >>
Biz
Clement has one option left
Can you imagine the activity on here crowing if Freddy had signed for $10 mil or less? But because it was $12 mil, chirp, chirp, chirp . . .
But it was a "legitimate" offer by Neal, the straight-shooting genius. I'm sure that extra million per would have handcuffed the organization for years to come. We dumped Ramirez in 2003 and have been looking to get a power hitting 3rd baseman since. Now we're looking for a 2nd baseman. No, it's not the exact same thing, but it does or should cause you to think . . .
two posts ago, i meant 'sic' not 'sick'....but sick kinda works too.
- Lobes
Buster Olney's latest story on espn.com mentions that there could be a lot of veteran players that will be non-tendered and becoming free agents this off season. Could become a buyers market for short term help.
NoHu -
great summary of this blog my friend...... by the way, as I uncovered a few days ago, the pizza was not on Nutting.... I was chastized for thinking that was another example of Nuttings cheapness.
JJ -
YOu are correct sir. I find nothing positive in the FO and Nuttings..... they are a complete and utter falure.....their track records backs up my opinion.
You on the other hand seem to never disagree with anything they do and you ranting of Hills minor league replacement was utterly rediculous and proves my point.
Read NoHu's post today.... I believe he may have been quoting you.
Wheres the free pizza FRANK?!?!!!!
imo, Clement is not gonna be the answer. hope i'm wrong but i'm guessing he never will.
- eardrumdrew
Thanks, JAL
So lets think back, when was the last time we signed a free agent that was a good move? Not counting Legend, that was a minor league FA, I'm talking about a major league player that had positive impact to this franchise?
Suppan???
I'm heading out to spend the next 5 hours in my tree stand.
I'll give it some thought and get back to you tonight or tomorrow.
I'm definitely interested.
Arriba,
there was some discussion on last night about Freddie's new contract. Most people are happy for him -including me. But some, including me, think it is a big risk for SF. Especially in year two.
TC - Thanks for sharing. i've been sorta hearing that rumor (non-tendering) for a month now...i think Olney's story gives it that much more credibility.
Also probably means that PBC may be best suited to wait to fill some of the holes. As ST approaches, if there's an excess and some (many) not signed, there could be REAL bargains and REAL excess available. I know it's frustrating to sit still while Yankee-like teams feed on the top line talent...but probably not a bad strategy in this year for lower revenue teams. We're not going after same talent that Yankee-RedSox-Angels etc chase. I'm just hoping we go after better talent than we've chased in past.
- SuperTympanicDrew
Kenny Lofton and Reggie Sanders were also good FA pickups that year.
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He is a gamble, basically a dumpster acquisition, tired of try outs, we have a 1st basemen in Jones, lets get an outfielder and a 2nd basemen of quality, throw in a lefty or two in the pen and call it a good off season.
depends on what you define as impact--Mientkiewicz was an FA signing.
I know it's frustrating to sit still while Yankee-like teams feed on the top line talent...
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Teams like the Yankees don't have a lot of holes to fill, I think the PBC will play the waiting game, at least I hope so.
A guy like Abreu would be a good fit in right field for a couple of years. I am not sure if we lose a 2nd rounder for him though.
I hate giving up that 2nd rounder for anyone, but you do what you gotta do.
Somone else mentioned Crosby, that's why I remarked on it. I do like him and have seen him play. Agreed that his is similar to what we have in a couple of ways...except maybe he's played a little more 2nd than Andy has.
Daryle...good to see you back, but you know it's not necessarily a good idea to mention Dallas football here on a Pittsburgh newspaper blog, even if it is a baseball blog. :-)
Has anyone watched Matsui run lately? Yinz thought Adam was slow! At least Adam is agile enough to field his position, I'm not so sure Matsui could.
Leadoff,
The only thing about Abreu that scares me is his age.
But at this point I would trade a proven track record of production for at uncertainty of a second round draft pick.
Especially if our last 2 drafts are as good as some seem to think.
Hos - got it. Enjoy the shooting.
PS - the gist of my idea is the rate EVERY move independently
eg, losing Perry gets a negative score, signing Garcia gets a positive score but not as high a positive as the negative for losing Hill. signing a not-so-hot L reliever gets a very small positive score, if L relief still open at Opener, the HOLE gets a bigger negative. Signing a SOLID OF gets a BIG positive score, signing a SOLID 2B gets a BIGGER positive score because it's filling a bigger need, signing a SOLID 1B gets a big positive score but not quite as big as equal-bat-OF signing because Legend is stronger at 1B than OF.
The BIG HOLE in my system is that EACH AND EVERY score is completely discretionary and open to constant debate/disagreement...see our earlier posts re: Blalock. What i liked about our Draft scale was that we pre-set criteria, which was how we ended up with only fractional difference in final grade.
BTW, whatever system we use, i think we should give MID-TERM grade on Opening Day - since it's just impressional at that point - and FINAL grade at some point in season where we have enuff time in to judge, say All Star Break. For instance, while i gave first impression grade of 09 draft as B-, i've since raised to B based on DRAMATIC improvement in winning percentage of PBC minor league teams when these guys started playing. (went from combined .470- to combined .530+ for two+ months. I'll reserve any further grade climb potential until i see how Sanchez progresses. I'm happy with first half-season of course, but it was just his first half-season.
The Yanks will have holes. Matsui is a free agent -and I think Damon is too. Both are old and declining...especially in the field. Besides closer their bullpen seems to have some holes too.
TC - agree re Sanders, Lofton. If we can find Sanders rather than Burnitz and keep Legend at 1B, i'm very pleased
Biz - yes, Suppan was a great acquisition for this team at the time. no question.
Leadoff - I agree with your criteria of needs/goals. However Abreu, imo, is not worth BOTH the money AND the 2nd pick. Ok with move if just money.
DMac - unless Crosby can play on ice, i think it's only a marginal upgrade. I wouldn't HATE it if we do MUCH better at OF and L relief holes, but if all our signings arel like that, just borderline-marginal upgrades, i'm not happy. for instance, we don't need a 4th OFer type to fill hole. We gotta coupla those. We're not getting a Clemente, but i wanna real OFer.
The better we do at ONE signing gives some (but not total) leeway on another.
TC - spot on. Y's have GREAT infield but their OF is fairly good but not very good NOW, and it's, aging and departing. And Petitte is old and probably will eventually retire even if still some gas left, especially if he can go out a champion. So i see them seeking 2 not 1 OFer (maybe settle for 1) and a pitcher.
Thunder
Ibanez is 2 years older for the Phillies. He is still solid, what a difference our outfield would have been with him this year, also he would like our right field porch.
BFD
Pepperoni pizza?
I posted that I would be happy with some quality pickups at 2nd base, outfield and the bullpen.
The one area that I think is vital in a couple of these pickups is solving the lack of production 2-6. If we pick up a 2nd basemen, to me he has to hit, If we pick up an outfielder, he has to hit. Also both of them have to play some decent defense.
Not looking for all catch, no hit players.
another thought about long-shot signings. i certainly wouldnt be EXCITED by this but: If they sign TWO long-shots for essentially same position, that's better than one. Sounds kinda obvious, so let me put it into example. If they sign Blalock AND Baldelli (knowing that Jones can fill either position), and hope that ONE of those B's turns into a return-to-form player, i wont be excited by ANY stretch but will acknowledge that it's better than just signing ONE of them.
(yes, i know, i earlier put Blalock higher on my list...this is intended as an EXAMPLE for those who don't rate either very high)
NOTE: I am NO LONGER gonna use the false-positive term "(hoping to catch) lightning in a bottle." ok, well, NOW no longer after THAT use. I'm gonna call those type of signings what they are: Longshots. I have NO problem with SOME longshots. So if we sign ONE solid L relief and sign another one or two to compete, bringing 2 longshots to ST to compete for 2nd slot is a solid strategy as long as we've already got one good one. Two longshots battling for one spot is ok. As long as there is still a "shot" to go along with the "long", meaning there's a potential for upside.
BFD, again be specific to my rant on carlos, read very slowly this time and then read Chuck Finders story even slower, guess what ? I copied and Pasted his words.
Some of your issues are with him. The guy has had a team defense at the major league level that had done just what Perry before he went over the hill did with the pirates this year, best in the league.
Explain his non ability to do the job, where is that evidence you claim to have that says he can not do the job?
Going over the hill is a well documented saying. It has a very close tangent to what happened with perry this year, sorry you are not aware of that known saying which is not mine.
Count the posts that give Carlos a congradulation on his new job, I am not in the majority.
Heck, I did not even congradualte him myself.
What I saw was a team going nowheres the last two years.
What I saw was team members who when added up were not going to win a thing.
What I saw was a situation where pick any single one of those and pretend you had eight of them, guess what, you are still going anyheres.
many people besides myself have had the opinion that a tear down was in order.
What I know and maybe you do not is that there was not a single player in our system who could strecth their necks above who was on the team. The team was bad. The team was not built by the current management team. The replacements from the minors were dismal in comparison, again not built by the current managemnt team.
You must be one of those who think the team prior to the break up was a player or two from competition.
At the very first gathering I placed my order that the team was three startinmg pitchers and at least three or four everyday players away form any sense of competition.
We will see what we see when those received punch their ticket for those who have gone gone gone.
I have delayed gratification. I know no more than you if those we now have who are in the system will take us to some competition.
I choose to reciprocate some respect for those on the field of play that show they have the desire to play competative baseball.
Frankly, my father taught me better manners than to whine whine whine.
you want to believe that this managemnt team has been here for 15 years and every player we had prior to the nady deal and every player in the system was acquired by this management team, then i say thats all I need to know about why you expected the pizza to be bought.
Lead "Not looking for all catch, no hit" 2B and OF.
i agree COMPLETELY. If OF is not great at D, as long as he's not a DY experiment, i can live with that. Because: Keeps Jones at 1st where he's better D, and Clutch is good D with potential Great, and Milledge is ok D with potential Good.
But 2B, YES. Especially if Cedeno (a questionable but not experimental player) stays at SS, i think we NEED a solid glove at 2B.
Drew...I agree we've got bigger holes to fill. I guess I was saying out of the FA's listed in a previous post, I liked Crosby. I don't seem him here though...we don't need him and I think Oakland may try to hang on to him until they know what's up with Chavez, unless they have someone up and coming in their system. :-)
Thanks JAL,
Do you happen to know the date.
Daryle, the date was Oct. 24th, I am to blame.
DMac - i agree... i think he'll be resigned and stay there.
I wonder if the Pirates would be wise to take a shortstop in the draft, Chris Colon is the best available, very good hitter, occasional power, defensive wiz with great hands.
The problem with him is he is projected somewhere between 5 and 8 in the draft order, the Pirates draft 2. Do you drop down and get a middle infielder of pedigree or to take the best available at no. 2
We keep talking about signing a second baseman, and lefty relief, who exactly? What targets are there? (I don't think much based on whos projected to go FA) Its easy to say, lets go to the store and buy some lobster, but if the lobster isn't there, not much one can do at all, is there?
I mean, srsly
Thanks folks forgot about Dirty Doug (more impact on clubhouse than the field), Lofton who we traded in the Ramirez (sigh) deal, and Reggie Sanders. Why we didn't either re-up Reggie or trade him in August/September is beyond me.
But I guess my point is, other than Dirty Doug, the last FA of any impact we signed was in 2003?
Why would this off-season be any different? Especially with the philosophy of "this is what you are worth" and thats all we'll pay, not condemning the philosophy, but its not conductive to aggresive FA signings, IMHO, as per usual. Plus there is not many to be aggressive about.
Regarding Abreau, word I've read is he wants a two year deal with a salary to make up for what he lost this year.
To be fair, the comparisons of these players to Randa and Burnitz are not real parallels. Randa and Burnitz were in their late 30's when they signed with the Pirates, and they were both coming off seasons where they had positive value.
The Pirates paid them like they expected that kind of production to continue, when the normal thing would be that their production should decline like it did.
These players on the target list are all around 30, when Burnitz and Randa had a much better chance of having positive seasons.
I would consider most of these players a better bet than Juan Uribe was this year with the Giants. Uribe had only one year of over 100 OPS+ before this year, which was 5 years ago. The Giants took a chance this year and he paid off for them.
Now, do you trust that Uribe is going to duplicate this year's performance, or will he revert back to his previous form?
The one thing you can be sure of is the Pirates will not be paying any of these players as 2-3 WAR players, and yet it is possible you could get that from many of them.
They will probably pay them like 1 WAR players, about $3M-4M per year, and hope they put up 3-4 WAR stats like they are capable of. Then, if they are actually 0 WAR players, they have lost that gamble.
But it could still be a decent gamble to take.
If that is what he wants, he could be around this year like he was last year till ST.
As for where you get someone you need, you can also trade with somebody, we have chips and money if we get the right deal. Who knows, might have a shocker come out of the winter meetings.
This administration has shown that they always have their hands in the cookie jar, never know what they will come up with.
daryle
here you go
community.post-gazette.com/.../afternoon-baseball-talk-10-24-09.aspx
All anybody has to know is that the Pirates never, ever make the right moves. History proves it. So many acquisitions turn out awful. In fact, most of them. So many people who leave here find success. It's amazing how many ex-Pirate players and coaches find meaningful roles on contending teams.
Truth is, no winner wants to be here, and they never will, until Nutting either sells or dies.
Today my mantra is owlike, who, who, who is there to sign.
Folks, I think we are just wishing.
Forgot to say, in earlier statement that Abreau is out of our market
OF FAs to date
GAnderson - 38
MAnderson - 36
JBay, Type A - 31
EBrown - 35
Byrd - 32
CCrawford, 10 mil option
Damon , Type A - 36
Dellucci - 36
Floyd - 37
Holliday, Type A - 30
RJOhnson - 33
Norton - 37
WMPena - 28
Manny
DRoberts - 38
Sheffield - 41
Tatis - 35
RWinn - 36
Ankiel - 30
Baldelli - 28
Cameron - 37
Chavez - 32
Coco Crisp, 8 million option
Erstad - 36
Freel 34
Hairston Jr- 34
AJones - 33
Kotsay - 34
Cory Patterson - 30
Podsednik - 34
Wise - 32
Abreu - 36
Dye - 12 million mutual option
Giles, ugh
Guerrero - 35
Hinske - double ugh
Jenkins - 35
Kearns - 10 million club option - 30
JMichaels - 34
Nady - 31
Thats it for now, don't see any lobster at our price in there
I used to get all excited and caught up in the FA speculation every year. But I really just don't care about it anymore. I enjoy focusing more on the draft and players developing in the system because that's where success will eventually spring from (if it does).
Trying to guess what transactions the club will make or should make over the winter is an amusement, I suppose, but chances are what happens may not have anything to do with long term success.
Do you drop down and get a middle infielder of pedigree or to take the best available at no. 2?
=================================================
If you are talking about a trade, MLB doesn't allow trading of draft picks a la every other organized team sport in the known universe.
I think lead meant maybe that they might take a projected mid-round guy. instead of best available at #2
...if he's the best infielder available.
On Hank Blalock -
It's easy to look at Hank Blalock's poor OBP and think that he is not good. And you might be right. Or not.
A big criticism of Rudy Jaramillo in Texas has been the drop off in OBP for the entire team, due to the fact that Jaramillo has been overly emphasizing being aggressive early in the count.
Most of his years with Texas, his approach led to some of the best SLG numbers in the majors. However, it seems that at one point he just got carried away and nobody was getting on base before the home runs.
The typical Rangers game this year was Ian Snell's start that I witnessed. Snell threw more balls than strikes, but the Rangers walked few times, and managed only a few hits - two of which were solo HRs.
It's possible that if Blalock works with Don Long, who emphasizes a more patient approach, that he could become a productive hitter again.
______________________________
I was talking about passing up a projected 2 slot player for a projected 5-8 spot player to get a position of need player.
Wow..another ugly Iowa win.Whew!I was on ESPN.com and the line most used......."not a hater,just a realist"I never heard that before!!!!!!!Geez the first person that used that line should have got patent rights.That's as a standard line here.As we all know.
________________________
Bay is the best lobster in the tank and I think he is talking 15mil a year for a one dimensional player right now.
I don't know what our prices are these days, I think it would depend on what is available.
I know that they can put Tabata in right and Jones at first and cure 2 problems at once.
They can trade for Uggla, thru Arbitration he will probably get 6-8mil this year, we have the money for one player at 6-8mil, that would take care of the position players too start the year next year.
I don't know of any left handed bullpen pitchers that would cost an arm and a leg, if we could get one for 3-4mil, we would be looking at adding about 12mil to the payroll, putting us at around 41mil next year, far below the payroll this year.
Leadoff, Zisk, WSB has been calling for drafting a SS first for some time now, rest assured he is on the side. I do not recall his order of preferred SS's.
Good afternoon inmates near and far.Great win for Hawkeyes. TC, tell us more about the potential untendered players. Any 2b's on that listg? If LaRoche shows a better glove in ST at 2b than DY, but his offense suffers, is it worth the switch? Reason for asking is many players drop in offense while trying to learn a new position.
TC--I did skim those comments on Freddy before I posted; my point stands and you know it's true. I agree with the poster(s) who said Freddy was underappreciated here, even though he did drive me crazy at times with his aversion to BB's and situational hitting.
Olney thinks the first few days will be much like feeding the carp bread up at Pymatuming Lake, they almost walk over each other, at the beginning of FA signing period making sure the top guys get the top dollars, and vice versa the teams that can afford will get the top guys.
Leadoff, whom exactly do we have to trade without weaking the ML team?
While everyone wants players with high OBP, the thing the Bucs need is players who can get runners home from 3rd with less than 2 outs. A good RBI guy is more valuable than another non-productive singles hitter. That is why guys like Blalock are under consideration.
RWave, there wasn't a list with Olney's column. But I think he mentioned Garrett Atkins as a potential free agent (sp?)
Arriba, Freddie did get a good deal for himself. And maybe a lot of posters are happy for him & surprised by the deal all that the same time. I still think SF had some pressure to sign him --and if he stays healthy he's a very good ball player. But I have to wonder too if Freddie thought this was the absolute best deal he was going to get--without testing the open free agent market.
What do people think of Brad Hawpe if he became available?
Arriba - i agree with your assessment. not that i thought there was even a remote chance that it would happen, but i would have been very pleased to have Freddy return. I thought PBC offered reasonable-low at, i think, $6 M yr 1 and $4 M yr two, and i would have thought it worthwhile to push yr 2 to $6 like Giants. But even if PBC had, almost certain Freddy would have picked Giants over PBC for several obvious reasons. 2 yr contract would have been about perfect to see if lower minor internal options can be ready, and because anything longer for Sanchez probably not wise.
Noah Lowry may become a free agent. He was hurt last year but seems to getting healthy. He may be worth a flier on --minor league deal.
Drew - I agree with you about Freddie. But the Bucs offer of $10mil vs the deal with SF for $12m --really isn't that far apart. He got 2 more million. In the world of baseball that doesn't seem 'far apart'.
But I don't blame Freddie for taking it and I don't blame the Bucs for their offer.
We have some young players in the minors that we can make available, we don't have to trade them all, just a couple.
We are not building the minor league system just to supply the major league team, they can't all make the team.
All teams with built systems use their minor league systems to obtain other talent when they need to.
To get a guy like Uggla for example, it will take prospects, the Marlins like young, cheap prospects with high upsides.
So we part with a couple, we have another draft coming up where we should land another bunch of good young talent.
Just using an example, we might trade a Moskos and a Grossman, of course I am just speculating. these are the type of players that I am referring to.
btw, i thought the financial offer to Wilson by PBC was dead-on reasonable. i also guessed by reading-between-lines that if not for the 2-for-1 requirement of Wilson to also sign Sanchez, that Wilson would have signed it.
Would i want Wilson to return? tough question but glad "you" asked. hmmm. i was always pro Wilson in past. Didnt overvalue him, understood his tangibles were ok not great, but when combined with intangibles, attitude/community stuff and solidifying a key position, i valued him a bit more than his tangible skills might otherwise call for. but would i seek his return now? pains me to say it but no.
Granted, Cedeno is no more than adequate, but he is that at least, and cheap and young. Sometimes one has to make business decisions and while i still like Wilson more othan Cedeno head so head, it's not that simple. Money comes into it, and i'd rather spend that money on 2B or OF, where we have a hole, than upgrading an 'adequately' filled position and leaving another hole.
TC - i agree. When i said PBC was reasonable-low at 10 mil 2 yrs, i should have clarified by saying Giants were reasonable-high at 12 mil. Both offers in reasonable range, in fact they each probably defined the high-low extent of the reasonable range.
TC - from earlier today...i asked mrs drew and she said ONE of my ears (right) sicks out like Ross Perot, not both. Sort of a pathetic half-moon-rising kinda thing. she also says i have a pointy head but that's a topic for another day.
ok, everyone must be out stealing candy.
Have a great Halloween.
Bye
leadoff, IMHO, if we end up trading more than we got for Freddy, which it appears you are advocating, and only have the guy for two years at a much higher price than we could have kept Freddy for, for two years or so, then this organization is totally messed up. All the talk about depth and talent, gaining it, gathering it, and its mostly questionable. Florida is sharp, they are not going to give this guy up for anything less than top notch talent. Moskos (a disappointment) and Grossman (that guy is a stud) would simply make them laugh, you'd have to throw in Gorzy (fine by me) and their pick of people that us on the blog have no idea about.
What you are advocating is a deviation from the master plan, or from my perspective so it seems. This club is not really worried about 2010, except for public perception and always attendance.
Keep the dream though if you wish, and I will say I was wrong if this ever happens.
Drew71, the thing that gets me is we traded folks and have no back-ups, so now folks are advocating trading what was so "important" to get. Our system is not there yet, we have a bunch of maybes, thats it. I agree, Freddy was reasonably priced, yes, swung too much, but a solid player that could have helped us get over this rebuilding period.
TC--thanks for raising the "it's only 2 million more" argument. I would have been disappointed if someone didn't. Yeah, it's only $2 mil, what the hey. If it had been $8 mil that he signed for would you make the same argument? I'm guessing that if he had signed for $10 mil, the posts about how the FO knew what they were doing would have bombarded this website on Monday. It's also 20% more than the Bucs "best bolt." I'm sure $2 million to Freddy is way less of an impact than $2 mil to BN. They never wanted Freddy to accept the "offer" and it was clearly, despite their protestations, a PR move. OK, I'm done on Freddy. I feel better. No offense.
leadoff said...
================================================
A team should NEVER draft for need. Period. You draft for talent. The reason is that you never really know what your needs are going to be 3-5 years in the future when that player is ready for MLB.
On Freddy's deal...
I'm not surprised he got what he did. I was expecting $6M per year. That pays him expecting him to be about a 2 WAR player for 2 years. Since he might be a 3 WAR player one of those years, it allows for a down year in one of them.
The question for the Pirates is - is it worth more to get a prospect back in trade and then find a similar value player for either the same price or less?
I think in the case of Sanchez, the answer is yes.
This year:
Freddy Sanchez was worth 2.2 WAR (-2.3 hitting / +6.7 fielding).
Andy LaRoche was worth 2.6 WAR (-1.9 hitting / +5.4 fielding).
I'm betting Andy gets better, and Freddy has a hard time staying healthy. So, moving Andy to 2B when Alvarez comes up actually is a better deal for the Pirates.
Biz, what are you talking about? We got Alderson for Freddy he is a minor leaguer.
Too bad you missed the gathering because you missed a scoop on Moskos.
You said you would say you were wrong about the draft signings and they did what you said would be enough and you just moved onto your new mantra.
All this kumbya stuff will go on deaf ears.
freddy will be on the national league champs next year, and hardly recall the signing slight/mishap.
if we continue to think we have a need to fill the holes left by his and wilson's trade, then that is an FO problem that they sold out prior to plan for replacement, OR the plan was flawed and talent misjudged, or as I suspect, they feel 2010 is a hold 'em. and I agree on the latter.
I am all for trying to help the young ones forward, but really, why spend ANY $ next year on yard sale? does anyone think we are out of the basement with or without blalock/ankiel/khalifa/bubba/eta l? above .500? really?
I prefer patience, good prescription meds for 2010 and home grown. plow it into the future, not 2010.
Arriba, I bet you are not done
I'm glad to hear about the interest in Khalil Greene. I think he can be signed for practically nothing. Bobby Crosby, IMHO, is about the same risk of failure as Greene is, but will cost a lot more.
I think signing Greene and trading for Kelly Johnson (who I think can be got for not much) gives you plenty of options. If they both tank, you bench 'em, shift LaRoche to 2B, and bide your time until Alvarez is ready (and maybe you call him up before you'd actually like). If LaRoche hits well enough to stick at 3B, then you play whoever's on a tear or platoon them. If they both return to their peak ability, you can find places for them to play (Johnson can play 2B or OF; Greene can play 3B, SS, or 2B). It's a gamble, but it don't cost much to play and the return could be big.
So I don't see Greene as this year's version of Burnitz or Randa. Blalock, I think, would be.
Mark...only one problem with your Freddy/Andy comparison. Andy's +5.4 fielding contribution is at 3B...and that number has been statistically shown to drop considerably when a 3B moves to 2B. If the Pirates are LUCKY...on the positive side...his fielding numbers will be close to zero. For Andy to be a benefit at 2B at all...he MUST hit considerably better next season than in 2009.
Rain delay in Philly with no rain falling?
Cajun
Maybe, but stats do not always work for every player. Some improve, some decline, and some stay the same. Also, Andy would not have to hit better because 2b is not a power position despite Chase Utley.
Now it is raining in Philly
I had no idea that Tim McCarver has a record. It can't be any worse than... oh, I don't know... let's say... EMF. Here is the Amazon site. Pay particular attention to the reviews.
www.amazon.com/.../B002OJGGH6
Mark
In this case the 2 slot does not have any more talent than the 6th pick. Much like this year after the top 2 there was not much difference between 3 and 15.
I think in this case I am going to take the shortstop, he serves both need and he is probably as good as the 2 slot.
It just won't look good that we passed on the 2 slot.
A team should NEVER draft for need.
_____________________
The Pirates whole draft last year was for need. All those back end pitchers were drafted for need. They gave up that high draft slot last year to draft for need.
Concerning McCarver's record:They played it on Mike & Mike, actually for that style of music it's prettygood, the guy can sing.
Halloween Scary, you heard it from me first within 2 weeks of the Trade Sanchez to the Giants. I said he would sign for them during the off season at similar price or more than we/Pirates offered. This is a huge coup for the local to me SF Giants. Congrats, you succeed where my beloved pirates team management fails.... We need better puzzle game players than the current Nuthouse gang and the circus circus group we pay for their employment.
Go Pittsburgh, city of champions and my pumpkin patch pirates LOL!
David
StevePegues makes an excellent point concerning K Greene. He can be purchased for a comparatively low price, provide skill at a needed position, and possibly offer the Pirates a few more options position-wise. If for some reason he does not work out, then the Pirates are not out all that much. Greene, although having had a reall poor year, might be just the surprise player the Bucs need. Comparing Greene quality-wise to Randa and Burnitz IMO is under-rate his true ability. While there have been questions raised to supposed social anxiety problems he had, perhaps he was just a higher quality player playing for the wrong team. Granted this is my opinion, but the Pirates will not be out that much if he doesn't pan out. The Pirates still have some options anyway for adjusting players for different positions.
As leadoff suggests, if there is not that much different skill-wise after the top several picks, why not select someone to fill a needed position? I know it has been expressed many times over, but that is still one of the questions I had and still do as to why the Pirates are seeking strength up the middle when they already had it but chose to get rid of it. It's water over the dam, but keeping Jack and Freddie then complementing them with McCutch and Jones would have added to the Pirates overall strength even though there are many who argue the Bucs had to trade them while their monetary value was at its highest. The FO still has money to spend to continue building on what we currently have. I really think the Pirates jumped into the river to get out of the rain with those moves. Even if a .500 record is not considered progress, it really is when you consider that the won-loss record is definitely headed in the right direction knowing that skilled, upcoming players are getting the experience to fill vital positions in the years ahead. Who knows what the Pirates have planned for this next season. Hopefully it will continue to build on what strength that is starting to emerge.
If I could ask for a late Christmas present from Bob Nutting, Frank Coonelly, and Neal Nuntington it would be to discover by opening day 2010 that:
"Yeah, ok, you opened the wallet for a couple of free agents that you believe can help this year. I get that...But thankfully you guys didn't cull the growing herd (small as it is) down on the farm for just the short term."
Anyone can see that the resurrection of the Pittsburgh Pirates Baseball Club is going to take quite some time.
And it SHOULD (if it's done right)- It's the reality of the situation!
Successes will come- If increasing amounts of money and tireless effort are poured into scouting superbly, aggressively, and creatively in order to sign as much
highly-talented new blood as humanly possible from home and abroad. Invest more resources in training and development. Improve and build facilities- Whatever it takes. THIS is your penultimate marketing tool! THIS will eventually fill the seats!
Please have the integrity and fortitude to see your plan through. Throw away your watches. Let things develop. Put the blinders on and plough forward. If the club is still setting its dubious record for a couple more years- So be it!
Gentlemen, my fear is not that this plan you have implemented will not work. I fully assume that all three of you understand intrinsically that the future success (or not) and reputation of this ballclub will be intimately entwined with your own.
My fear is of our inherent human weakness: That one, two or all three of you may succumb to the intense pressures from without. And within.
I wish you all the fortitude in the world. It would be beyond exhilarating to see this team win again.
And even the fans who disagree with your plan, or who don't even believe you, deserve your total commitment to it.
Good evening brothers
Quiz for you. Which team site blog has the following message:
I wish _______ would do all the fans of the _______ a favor and sell the team. That is the only way this franchise will ever have a chance. Every other team in the great city of _______ has had great deals of success but the _______. the _______ have gone through several coaches and regimes, gerneral managers, and countless #1 draft picks not to mention top #10 draft picks and still the same end result; absolute failure. That draws to one conclusion, ownership. Let it it go _____ just let it go and please sell this team.
No prize money involved, but it is interesting to see who we are compared
Frankly, you daddy may have tought you manners (which apparently you are implying mine didn't), but he didn't teach you to think for yourself.
Everything is sunshine and rainbows in the Pirate organization with you..... wake up!
By the way, why is my comments whinning? I am stating my opinion that this organization is no closer to winning now than before your hero's FC and NH took over. They s*ck at evaluating talent, and executing trades. Bob Nutting is a cheap SOB. no whinning here.... just opinion with lots of losing to back it up.
Keep looking for that pot of gold at the end of your rainbow....when you find it you will only find crap.
JAL - I added the pizza avatar for Frank.....
Lions?
indiana -
got to be the Det Lions.
DING DING DING WE HAVE A WINNER
Love the avatar "B" (FD)
I just thought it was humorous when I read that entry that it could have been penned by our own Hoss, or Demery, or even you "B". But before i digress unto the name calling sprite. I just want yinz all to know that we are all in this together. Go Colts tomorrow, since the Steelers have the day off, I hope yinz all will join me in wishing that Jim Caldwell becomes the First coach to go 7-0 in his first year.
Guess it was a long day in that treestand.
JLP--how many of those 5 star reviews of Timmy's recording did you pen?
Pirates prospect Donnie Veal is aware of the Arizona Fall League's reputation as a hitter's paradise, but his numbers tell a different story.
Veal improved to 2-0 and dropped his AFL ERA to 0.71 on Saturday, allowing two hits and striking out five over four innings in the Scottsdale Scorpions' 6-0 win over the Peoria Saguaros.
Digital Dan: I posted last night from MLB.com that next Saturday night, the MLB network will televise first of 2 AFL games.
BFD, I actually was being nice by lowering the bar on conversation of your name calling into whining. Try for once to conversae with out it.
do you remember when Halloween was a kid's holiday?
boy, times have changed.
BFD, I think you a bit on the defensive, i did not imply a thing, just answering your question as to why I do not whine.
Guess what you think you did, weazle out of answering the question, where's the beef? where is the evidence Carlos is a bad choice a not quslified choice ad where is the evidence I am one of his tea totlers?
As for thinking for ones self you tend to think that the team we had which were losers were winners, who was on the field for the time this management team was here ? losers.
I already said we will see if their trading ability turns out to get us competitive or not. Too early to tell.
The only trade that some are calling not too well is Jason's. That may work out not bad, remember this was Andy's first year non hurt and he played better defense than Jason ever has at a harder position.
Last chance, provide the evidence that carlos was not a fair chance for the job.
Provide the evidence that you claim you say about me and my thoughts on everything bla bla bla, not spout, hard evidence??
I fail to see the point by the childish mock about the pizza.
JAL, stright from Emily post pointed out to you that we were the ones who invitted Fc to be our guest, are you implying that you find ways to invite people out and get them to pick up your tab? Even your tip or don't you tip?
That, sir is a whine by you.And if he had some way had paid for it, you would be whining he bought us off.
I think your rainbow is the color of brown.
If you can not provide the evidenses, then the conversation is over.
Where in the caoching track record is it clear that carlos has not been or can not be a major league infiled coach?
Drew, do you get tied up?
Just because Perotto threw a few names out there, does that really mean this FO is changing its 'plan'? How does this somehow become 'well, they're just like the last administration, going after over-the-hill FA's'? There is no guarantee we will sign ANY free agents, let alone guys mid-30s or older. Give it a rest. The only name on the record, so far, I believe is Ankiel I'd rather here them from NH before jumping to conclusions.
And, I for one am thrilled with the Carlos Garcia move. Having been fortunate enough to meet and spend some time with him some years ago, I can honestly say I was extremely impressed by him as a person. He has had success at this level and should fit in just fine.
Las Vegas Fan wrote and i add way to go Carlos. i too now that i am over being side tracked say congradualtions and the best of luck to you!
Too much candy? no morning thread yet so morning links will wait as this thread has over 140 posts on it.
@Joe: "Drew, do you get tied up?"
Sorry Joe, can't answer that, being that this is a family blog anat.
;-)
I'm with Vegas, and have been since annoucement, re congratulating and happy about Carlos. Glad he's one of the coaches. Taking nothing away from Hill and and his many clarifying rants...he was a terrific coach and i didnt want him to leave. But once he did leave he's gone. Thanks for the memories and, as PoH once wrote, kthxbai. Welcome Back Carlos. Sooooo....Hit it John Sebastian: (music up)
Welcome back, a trade was your ticket out.
Welcome back, to that same old place that you dreamed about.
Well the names have all changed since you played second base, but those dreams have remained, the dreams we're gonna chase.
Who'd have thought they'd lead ya (Who'd have thought they'd lead ya) Here where we need ya (Here where we need ya)
Yeah he's coaching first base cause Hill's a head case, welcome back, welcome back, welcome back, welcome back.
Carlos may be a descent coach.... he may not.... I might be a good iF coach...might not. my point is that you and many others praised Hill like he was Jesus, now he is gone, it is good riddence, Carlos is the man. Were's your proof that he is so great IF coach? wasn't he in the minors most rescently?
Read NoHu's summary from earlier.... it pretty much summed up my point about he Hill/Carlos affair.
You are correct... as far as the Bucs go, the rainbow is the color of pooo.... brown.
Nuff said on this subject.
aw, c'mon BFD, sing along with me.
"Yeah he's coaching first base cause Hill's a head case, welcome back, welcome back, welcome back, welcome back."
Even if you don't agree, you GOTTA agree that the tune is catchy! Betcha i could even get Hossy to sing. He LIKED the 70s!
ok, serious comment on Carlos: Leaving Hill out of the discussion, just considering Carlos:
1) there is statistical evidence that he can coach. He raised Seattle's infield D to top 5 in baseball statistically
2) he's been in PBC system and knows what PBC wants to teach
3) he worked a bit with Hill, so if Hill is the demi-god that some claim, maybe some of the ambrosia wore off on Carlos
All i'm saying...if we take Hill out of the equation and just cosider the hiring on its merits...we could have done a lot worse than Garcia. Experienced, history of specific IF success, knows system, rubbed elbows with Buddha.
hmmm....the inscrutable Buddha Hill. I think there's a 1940s Saturday Afternoon B-flick story line in there somewhere.
and ok, granted, Hos would change the words to "He's coaching first base cause we're such a cheap place" but at the risk of arrogant presumption, i think even he'd agree my words are funnier.
(but wait, aren't they BOTH kinda my words? Is this one of those Star Trek paradoxes? Oh gawd, let's not go THERE)
aw, c'mon, SOMEBODY play along. I'm on a candy-sugar high and i can't just keep posting to MYSELF all day!
JAL, JJ, you guys out there? You gotta save me from myself.
Tho JJ, you already did a pretty good job of that with the book.
(wow, a serious comment from Drew. ok, but don't tell anyone. would ruin my image.)
drew, my grave concern is you might be wishing you got to be tied up.
Drew, am not sure but I think you just broke the record for the number of consecutive posts, one blogger ; }
Sugar will do that to you, I guess
JAL, a special moring request, maybe a couple of links to new stories just to hold us over.
From yesterday, The top fifty prospect link shuts my computer down, maybe that gives allowences to placing just that onto the blothe story itself that is.
BFD, I never did such a thing, I have limited knowledge of up to date rosters outside of the Pirates, not the time to be that involved.
What I did do was acknowledge that I have used the same infield method for year only I call it my center of gravity teaching method.
Finally, certain ranters have won the page down catagory.
Drew, or is it,
www.youtube.com/watch
Biz top of the morning to you, pal.
Joe and Biz - yes and yes
Biz and Drew, or,
My sunday moring standard, karen, are you out there?
her flavorite
ok, we have a lurker set
Thanks for link...great song. I have DIFFERENT wildest dreams. Family blog...so see avatar and imagine!
Good morning all.
Drew...why are you on a sugar high already this morning? Candy for breakfast? ;-)
It seems to me we haven't been getting a new thread on Sundays.
OK
Some Morning Links
McKechnie would fit FSL like a glove
www.bradenton.com/.../1821115.html
Mehno: More than 300 miles divide Phils, Bucs
www.timesonline.com/.../mehno-more-than-300-miles-divide-phils-bucs.html
Smaller markets appear left out
www.ohio.com/.../68165507.html
Veal, Scorpions shut out Saguaros in AFL
DMac...you bet! We only had 10 t-or-treaters and mrs drew bought enough candy to feed the sixth fleet. hmmm, there's a follow-up comment to that...nope, not going there.
Joe - now THAT'S perfect. In the 70s, i looked a bit like Rich with his 70s hair and my best friend looked almost exactly like Scott, long hair and soul patch anat.
Drew - Love your song!
There may be a hidden gem in having Garcia instead of Hill not having to do with infield defense...
carlos-garcia-is-the-best-third-base-coach-in-the-history-of-baseball
ussmariner.com/.../carlos-garcia-is-the-best-third-base-coach-in-the-history-of-baseball
Drew -
catchy tune
but you said "2) he's been in PBC system and knows what PBC wants to teach"
-----------
what dioes the PBC want to teach?
- cheating the city and fans out of MLB baseball?
- salary dumping
- talking out of both sides of their mouth?
Knowing what the Bucs want to teach is not a positive in my book. They should be bringing in people with no prior ties to this organization..... losing breads losers mentality.
Again, carlos may be fine, the point of the criticizm is people here and in the organization talking Hill up like a god, and as soon as he is gone, he iis an old bum...."carlos will be a better younger version.... "
out