Morning links: Arbitration season begins

THE OFFICIALLY UNOFFICIAL PBC BLOGS AND MLB LINKS:

- Bucs Dugout: Vazquez Signed:

http://www.bucsdugout.com/

- WHYAVS: How Did The PBC Do At The WM? Also A Reader Poll:

http://whygavs.com/

- Wilbur Millers PBC Player Profiles: Added 3B Ramon Vazquez, who signed as a free agent:

users.rcn.com/.../pirateprofiles.htm

- MVN PBC.: PIRATE REVOLUTION, Podcast #2, PITTSBURGH LUMBER CO., Deal Finalized With Vazquez, SANDLOT SWASHBUCKLERS: Diaz Triples…Let The Catching Wars Begin:

http://mvn.com/mlb/pirates/

- Raise the Jolly Roger: News And Notes Vazquez Signs:

www.raisethejollyroger.com

- Mondesi’s House: PBC Back In The World Of Reality:

www.mondesishouse.blogspot.com

- Honest Wagner: R5:

www.honestwagner.blogspot.com

- The Burgh Blues: Vote For Pedro Martinez:

theburghblues.mlblogs.com

- The Green Weenie: Your 2009 PBC:

www.oldbucs.blogspot.com

- The Bleacher Report: Phillies Sign Ibanez 3Yr 30M:

bleacherreport.com/.../87380-mlb-hot-stove-updates

- In Clemente Weather: More From India:

inclementeweather.blogspot.com

PBC NEWS & NOTES (TODAY’S TOP PBC STORIES):

- PBC Homepage: Vazquez 2Yr 4M:

pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/index.jsp

Morning, Inmates.  Don't wake the nurses, but:

63 DAYS UNTIL PITCHERS AND CATCHERS!!!*

(* mlb.mlb.com/.../important_dates.jsp until the info changes...)

Hmm.. D-cab from the Orioles and Yancy Brozban from the Dodgers.  I wonder how his elbow is?  

keep Yancy's sliders away from Ryan Howard and he'll be fine.

I'm rooting for Veal to make it and make it big.  Anyone who loses both parents, then co-sign's a loan so his brother can go to college shows character that the PBC can be proud.  

Let's just call him ("Nuke") for the character in Bull Durham.

Vasquez from DK's article

"Anybody who's a Puerto Rican, whether you're a baseball person or not, the first name you think of in terms of respect is Roberto Clemente. It will be an honor to wear the Pirates uniform."

He knows how to sweet talk a city,

From DK's interview with Vazquez, of Puerto Rico:

"Anybody who's a Puerto Rican, whether you're a baseball person or not, the first name you think of in terms of respect is Roberto Clemente. It will be an honor to wear the Pirates uniform."

I liked that!

@UK - I guess he sweet-talked you and me, didn't he, Buddy!

Srsly, It's nice to hear him say he'll wear the Pirate uni proudly ...

Bay........were you reading over my shoulder?

;-)

Whoa, nice scoop by Newsday on the Pirates signing two Indian pitchers.  

I guess that makes 4 Indian pitchers, counting the two they signed several weeks ago.

Hey, wait a minute.......

I guess somebody will pick Wigginton up pretty quickly ... He's done nothing the last couple of years but prove the Pirates made a mistake in dumping him in 2005.

He's been a 20-25 home run man. Hope AnLa can get up to that tier in 2009.

The Buccos still need one more bench guy..............

Just a possibility!

Jaramillo/Dude from Jays  -  C

Vazquez  - IF

NygerM  -  OF

Pearce  -  OF/1B

Wiggington...?...?...?

We do have some extra dough even if we don't trade anyone.

DK: <MLB.com's absurd oversight in leaving Pedro Alvarez off a recent list of the game's top 50 prospects finally gets explained.>

Here's what I found disturbing from the article (short quote should be fair use, right?)

<So the only conclusion that could be drawn is that Alvarez's exclusion -- because most would probably agree he belongs talent-wise -- was a penalty for the controversy over his signing with the Pirates.>

Do I read that correctly?  You did something naughty, so now we don't like you, and because we don't like you, we're not gonna vote for you.  Well, they accomplished one thing: they held their breath, and we noticed.  *sigh*  I thought they were more "grown up" than that.

Obiviously, DK, it bugged you, too...  But should I not care?  Should I not have cared from day one?  Is it not, in some way, punishing the fans to say, "Your player isn't that good anyway?"  Why punish the fans, just when we finally think our club might be turning it around?

Well that is it for me...Last one out...You know what to do.

See you all in a few

From the "Rule 5 Fiasco" link comes another couple interesting points of reading:

Top 10 Worst Baseball Free Agent Signings Over the Last 20 Years bleacherreport.com/.../92159-top-10-worst-baseball-free-agent-signings-over-the-last-20-years

There's a former Pirate on the list but not who you might think at first thought.

Also, a debate over the state of free agency in baseball, given the recent bonanza secured by CC Sabathia:

bleacherreport.com/.../92031-cc-sabathia-signs-monster-deal-does-free-agency-need-equally-big-changes

No surprise on the non tendering of D. Bautista. He basically pitched himself out of a job with the PBC. Maybe a good reason the Bucs got Veal? I really don't thing the Bucs are that interested in him, even though they said they'd like to have him back. Too many mediocre relievers available for that to happen..........Viva Ramon Vasquez!!!!!!

DK<neat to as how this works out>  You are as nutty as the rest of us, my week was spent as a jepordy question might lead to this type of answewr fear and lothing in las vegas.

I am getting a bad feeling about who will be on first.

can ty play first?

Been trying to catchup on all the rumors from the past week, especially with regards to Jack.

Read ESPN's Buster Olney's blog yesterday, where he said the Dodgers "...are comfortable with the possibility that they might begin the 2009 season with Angel Berroa as their shortstop, but they continue to talk with the agents for Rafael Furcal." So, of course, Angel Berroa gets non-tendered by the LAD yesterday! Sometimes, the more you read these things, the less you know

And in more blog searcihing, SI's Ben Leiter, in his article on the top 50 free agents, targets the Pirates as the landing place for Kevin Millar. Kevin's a great clubhouse guy, but I think there's a better way to spend our limited $$$. I'd rather have Ty Wiggington, who can play 1B, 3B and the OF, than Millar. Or DD. And I think today's "non-tendered list" probably bumps a few people off SI's top 50.

For those interested, the SI link: sportsillustrated.cnn.com/.../index.html

The SI link

Juan<TY> We have the money to sign him.  I first off like the idea.  The bench starts off with Ramon who can play around the horn and can hit.  then Ty who can play all four corners and can hit.  

Can he play first base on a day to day basis.  drop the tender to adam sign ty He will get us out of the gate and that will be a better start.

Morning Links Part 3 or so

More info on the non-tenured

sportsillustrated.cnn.com/.../non.tendered.ap

Signings

www.usatoday.com/.../2008-12-12-roundup-signings-and-trades_N.htm

Will These Pitchers Bounce Back In 2009?

www.realgmbaseball.com/.../will_these_pitchers_bounce_back_in_2009

Non tendering D. Bautista was a good move.  Now if we look back at the season was his failure due to over use or just bad pitching?  Maybe resign him if the former?  JAL need some insight here.

If I am correct (and someone correct me if I am not), a player who is non-tendered can still resign at the asking price of the team, right?

If so, I bet that is what happens with a lot of those guys. And thats what the Bucs should have done with Ad Laroche

Morning, JJ, JAL, Mad & CullenH -

CullenH, That's an interesting point about Ad LaRoche ... I'm not sure what the process is ... If they non-tendered Adam, would the Pirates realistically be able to sign him back ... before someone else picked hm up? Could he run on (though he doesn't run very fast) to another team?

Or is it the kind of thing you wouldn't want them to sign him back?

JAL - Do you know how all that works? BTW, JAL, thought it was interesting that you, like Press Maravich, started out at WV Wesleyan ... another bit of trivia, Maravich had just retired from coaching Appalachian State University when I started there in 1976.

Morning folks. First post.

Just wondering if working out in Kansas is going to help Adam project to an over the Mendoza Line hitter in April/May.

Realizing that there is no sane, logical reason for it, I feel like the team is at least heading in the right direction. We may not agree with the moves (or lack of them) but at least there seems to be a plan. To me, NOT trading Wilson "just to trade him" showed me that while no player is sacred they are not going to trade just to trade (I will duck under my desk here as I don't understand trading Bay either).

As far as Joggin' Ronnie, I coach another sport. One of the kids shares DNA with a certain retired catcher. Word is that the retired person just could not understand why the Jogging One just didn't care - that he had all of this talent and this huge opportunity and just didn't give a flip. "Nuff said. good bye, good luck and have fun in Phillie.

Enjoy the blog, thought I would stop lurking and join in the fun...

Vic Davalillo, your Pirates need you....

JosePagan, welcome to the asylum! Wow, it is so super that you joined us this morning.

I agree with you. Nobody's perfect, and you never REALLY know how well the trades, signings, draftings are gonna work out, but I like the approach these guys have ... Hopefully, this is why they pay 'em the big bucks!

I thought it was really neat to read about the way they've stepped up their computer research department and how they landed those Latin guys out of the Minor League Rule 5 ... sounds like it turned some heads.

Now, if we can be like Tampa Bay ... Today, last place, tomorrow the World (Series, that is!), there will be mucho rejoicing around here.

Again, welcome aboard. Happy Holidays to you and yours!

@JosePagan

Welcome aboard and grab a straight jacket before they are all gone.

How it works as far I know

If you non-tender a player he becomes an FA and can sign with any team, including the team that non tendered him.  When you tender a player it means that you will offer him a contract.  The player can accept the offer or take it to arbitration by making a counter offer.  The arbitrator then picks either the team's offer or the player's and both sides have to accept that decision.  At any time before the the arbitrator makes a decision the team and player can agree to a contract.  Say the Pirates offer AL a one year contract for $6 million and he counters with an $8 million one.  Then the Pirates and AL decide to settle for $7 million.  They could also settle for a long-term contract.

Welcome Jose Pagan

Only one thing to say about AL this morn

AL in April 2008--80 AB  1 HR 5 RBI  .163 BA

AL in May 2008--105 AB  5 HR  19 RBI .257 BA

AL in June 2008--83 AB  2 HR 10 RBI .253 BA

Point--he did not wait until June to hit--he actually had a better May than June.

BTW--He went on a real tear in July hitting .390 with 7 HR and 18 RBI

Pirates were flirting with .500 through July so he did do some hitting when the games counted.  

Denny Bautista

I do not think it was overwork -he pitched 60 innings in 51 games.  

Grabow pitched 76 innings, Yates 73, Osoria 60, Capps 53, Marte had pitched 46 when he was traded and finished the season with 65.

JAL--you won't let this go, will you?  ;)

Welcome, Jose, but watch out for this guy JAL--he is very persistent.

Bring back Ty W??? not unless we bring back Littlefield and Anna B

Thanks everyone, and a Merry Christmas to you and yours!

Straight jacket? I have a nice double-breasted jacket (beige) with sleeves that tie in the back - is that the same thing?

I think it is cool that the new mngmnt team has "rediscovered" Latin America. Spent many happy hours as a child sitting in 3 Rivers watching Jose P, Vic Davalillo, Rennie Stennett, Manny and of course, The Great One ply their trade. Amazing that latin America had to be "rediscovered" by the PBC.

A LaRoche to me is the Poster Boy for Indifference. No offense, but if desire were water you could run through him and not get.

wet. that said, Mrs Pagan and I are looking forward to going to more games this year. We really don't care how bad they are - well, yes we do, but the Game is the thing and it is still cool to watch!

Join me in my campaign to end pierogie races, loud music between innings and the Parade of Fat Arses waddling in front of my face during 3 - 2 counts as the pitcher reaches the top of the windup...

Good points, JAL ... Arriba? Just kidding, I just thought that was so fun the other night when you guys "tussled minus" over AdLa.

Off on some chores ... just wish I could bring back some farm fresh milk like you, on Saturday mornings, JAL!

Bay

Do the chores well  --got some milk this am

Arriba

Well, others bring it up.  I am not defending him--his stats should be much better in April and more consistent throughout the season. All I was pointing out is that he hit better in May than June, contrary to what was being said.  If the Pirates got a good offer for him I would say take it.

And it was not just at the end of may--Hit Hr on the 4th, 6th, and 12th.  Drove in the winning run on the 8th.  Cleared the base with a 3 run double in the 10th on May 13.  Ned him to do such hitting in April, May, June, July, August, and Sept.

arriba, what is so bad about Ty?

JAL  I do not think anyone was stcking to a point that Adam progressed in an orderly manner, I think the point is: anyway you arrange the numbers they are no good for us from him

JAL--I was just kidding, couldn't resist because after I saw DK's morning links today I thought "I'm not going to go there"  Two things,now that you(and Bay) forced me--Adla's better May than June coincided with the only winning month (May 15-13) for the entire 2008 season (according to unofficial stats I saw) and your stats show he hit 8 home runs and 34 RBI for the first half of the season (April-June).

Pretty pitiful for your Big Bopper in a city that isn't paying attention to the "same old Pirates" by July.

JAL/Bay/Mad/Arriba/--Good morning everyone.

Nice to see everyone up and about this morning.

@Jose Pagan--I wish to echo the sentiments of Baywatch and welcome you aboard.

Yes the Beige Dbl Breasted Tie behind Jacket is acceptable.

Please have it tailored if necessary, nothing worse than a baggy dbl breasted str8 jacket..You will be talked about on the OS.   ;-)

JAL<trade him if you can get value>  There is no interest in his name so far, now he has no value.  If he threepeats and then hits .400 in july he will not garnish any talent worth the pain and suffering we will endure waiting for july.

a final comment to stats about his play being part of the W/L record.  What is not said is how would things have changed during games if he had been hitting his cracker jack average during those early games?

how many chanches did he have duiring those months and who was on abse and figuring in probabilities of when he may gt hits, so must admit if he is hitting .100 points higher he is going to drive in more runs which may beget some different outcomes to those games.

@JAL--Stats..

Please make thejump and change your name to Statman J.

:-)

Arriba

I know that you were kidding--we are all having fun with some of this stuff.  :)

JJ--Good morning...

JJ--I know this is not rational thinking on my part, but i would go out and see him play when he was with the Pirates and he was absolutely terrible offensively and defensively.  I understand the stats, but I was at least half kidding (reference to Anna B); the idea just hits my gut wrong based on what I saw when he was here.  I do remember there were flashes of "something," at times; he is just part of one of the mediocre DL deals that I've never liked him since even when he is hitting 20-25 HR's.

BK

Change my name--oh woe is one who changes names at the drop of a ground ball :)

JAL/Arriba -- When a player gets a reputation (like Adam for his slow starts) everything that he does that matches the reputation will be magnified and everything that goes counter to the reputation will be dismissed as an anomaly.  In playing about 30 games a month or so, he will do things that both confirm and deny the reputation.  You see a guy's cumulative BA every day and you think .225 hitter, not hitting .346 the last two weeks (made up numbers for the illustration, JAL) -- and right or wrong, this is what Adam has to overcome with a solid April.  

@JAL--<<at the drop of a ground ball :)>>

I just can not see any of us call you Error J.  ;-)

Statman J sounds cool...The great Scatman Crothers

(Ghost Riders In the Sky)

www.youtube.com/watch

JH

I agree--reputation does magnify opinion.  Any player can get off to bad start but it happens season after season it becomes a reputation.  

Since this is FA year we can hope he has one of those FA seasons so many players seem to have.  If he is hitting .290 with 23 HR in June then some contender with a hole at 1b may get very interested in him.

BK

Scatman--Statman-Batman-Cat Woman-X-Man-

Great version by Scatman

@JAL and anyone else with an opinion...

Money aside...Why not Furcal?

Is he that much of an upgrade over JW that we sign him?

He has not had big power #'s since arriving in LAD but that really does not concern me..286BA 20+SB other than 08 (injured correct?)

Anyone?

Hmmm--Cat-Woman

Is there something you wish to share with us JAL?

Your inner Feline showing her claws?

You bared them a little to Ron d last night....

I have to run...I look forward to reading this and others responses a little later be back soon

JAL <<Since this is FA year we can hope he has one of those FA seasons so many players seem to have.  If he is hitting .290 with 23 HR in June then some contender with a hole at 1b may get very interested in him. >>

If he does that (and the pitching comes around) maybe we'll BE the contender!

BK

Furcal had 4 seasons (2003-04-05-06) where he hit 15, 12, 14, and 15 HR but never hot more than 8 in any of his other 5 seasons.  Same age as Wilson.  Both lost much of last season to injury.  Furcal has a slightly higher BA.  From 2003 to 2007 Wilson hit 48 HR and Furcal 62 but if you take 2006 and 2007 its 21 HR Furcak, 20 HR Wilson.   Wilson's fielding pct is 978 and Furcal's 967.  Furcal faster with a large lead in SB.

Bottom line is that Wilson and Furcal are very close--Furcal a bit higher BA and a bit more power, and more speed, Wilson a better fielder.

Furcal, if healthy, would be an upgrade but not a big one.

Daniel Cabrera would be an interesting pick up i think he was better last year then anyone in our rotation, with the exception of Maholm, was

arriba, I was just wonmdring if I was missing on him about something in particular.

and the top of the morning to you, Billy

Re: Reputations, opinions, and optics

JHadar, I think you're half-right on AdLa.  There is a very specific reputation here, namely, "Adam LaRoche gets off to a slow start."  This reputation has been well earned, as is abundantly documented.  Further seasons of cold starts will only reinforce the pattern and magnify the reputation.

HOWEVER

The first time AdLa has a good start, he will immediately get credit for having "figured it out."  There will, naturally, be a period of caution -- maybe a week or two? -- where people are saying, "he looks good; is it for real?"  That's just normal, and I guess that's where your "dismissed as an anomaly" comes in.  But I really feel that the dismissal phase will be brief.  Surprisingly brief.

When he gets through that period, he will have shed the reputation, and we'll all be happy and smiling and rejoicing in the aisles.  And many of today's naysayers will be asking why we didn't lock him up to a 30-gazillion year contract before his "walk" year.  *G*

JAL--

Furcal isn't better than Jack, your stats do not show what Furcal did hitting in the 8th spot vs hitting in the 2nd spot, which is what Jack does. Anyone that doesn't think those spots make a difference shouln't follow baseball. Stealing bases has everything to do with the manager, he did not have the common sense to send Nate and there isn't a better base stealer in baseball. You know they were one their own, loved that one! sometimes managers have more control over the game than the fans think!!!!!

leadoff: <8th spot vs hitting in the 2nd spot>  You've mentioned this before.  It seems relevant, but what _was_ the average production for eight-hole hitters in the NL this past year?  And how _does_ JW's performance compare?

Sir--

Good quesion? JAL our resident stat man, possibly you could help us with that one.

Sir I don't know what the stats will show, I do know that hitting in the National league with the pitcher hitting behind you isn't easy, they can pitch around you most of the time when they want to get out of a big inning. Obivously in the American league it would not mean as much.

@leadoff--your statement @12:41

So we should only compare players that hit in the same spot and with managers that mange the same way?

<<Nate and there isn't a better base stealer in baseball>>

Where is that written??

Hello...Anyone home?

@Billy--So we should only compare players that hit in the same spot and with managers that mange the same way?

<<Nate and there isn't a better base stealer in baseball>>

This is my problem with stats, they don't tell the whole story!

Do you think it makes a difference to hit 8th vs 2nd?

I think when we are doing comparisons based on stats we need to take into consideration that different situations affect these stats.

Nate- I don't have his base stealing stats, I don't need them, I know he's got a high percentage of successful steals since he has been here.

The Manager- Absoultely- This is not a knock on a manager. There are running managers and there are conservative managers, when managers have the go sign on, your policy is not the same as go when I tell you. When you have a base stealer that is as good as Nate, you send him more than not, obviously game conditions can dictate what you do.

If you had Lou Brock and a manager that wouldn't let him go, he wouldn't have been what he was, some managers don't want guys to run, they prefer that hole between 1st and 2nd, I for one think when I got a stealer, I am going to get him going.

I do think Nate is the best stealer in the League and I think if someone told him to go and not let him decide on his own we would find this out. I don't call the best base stealer necessarily the one that steals the most bases.

Hey everyone!

Furcal vs. JW...If it's a wash between them, why not just keep Jack?  He may not run as fast, but if fielding gives Jack the edge, that would tip it for me.

I'm willing to bet that Nate had the green light to go whenever he felt like it, at least  most of the time.  He's a smart base-runner.

@Leadoff--Thank you for your point of view...I was playing devils advocate by my Q and comment.

Billy--

I understand, thats what makes baseball so special.

@Leadoff--<<baseball so special>>

Absolutely.

I am out for a few hours. Be back soon.

Nate--57 steals out of 62 attempts--career

The number 2 hitter and the number 8 are usually both contact hitters with the 8 hitting 2 if the regular 2 is out.  The 8 usually does not hit for as high an average as the 2 and usually has less power.

JAL, I'm with you all the way concerning Adam LaRoche.

If you look at his stats for the year he always has a pretty good overall season. Yes I understand the poor starts he gets off to, and that he is such a streak type of hitter.

But check around the league and there are several other players who look just awful for long periods of time. (Adam Dunn, H. Thomas among others)

The facts are AdLa. is a good player who cares very much about this team and it eats him up that he can't figure out how to avoid these slow starts, In fact it bothers him so much that it probable contributes to the problem.

If I felt that he was just one of those players who really didn't care and was just here for a pay check then I'd be one of the first to say get him out of here, but that is simply not the case with Adam. The Pirates could and certainly have in the past done much worse at 1B than Adam LaRoche.

I vote to sign him to a 3 year 25M contract and build the team around him. And the next time you’re at the ballpark give him a loud pick-me up cheer. Save the boos until Joggin Ronny comes to town.

OK, now I must take cover.  LOL

What should be the Pirates Wish list for guys to fall through the cracks:

PRIOR FREE AGENTS:

HITTERS:

IF:

1. Jason Giambi - why not? he would crush the ball in PNC. At the very least we could play him at first in April (he is the polar opposite of Adam Laroche great starts poor finishes)

2. NOMAHHH - could replace dougie fresh as our multiple position guy. Don't know if he has the fire in his belly though.

OF:

1. Rocco Baldelli - plays hard, has a mitochondiral disease, but he was there for Tampa's resurgence and he has soo much unrealized potential at age 27. if the price is right, we gotta take a shot at this guy.

2. Pat Burrell - This guy is an anti Laroche as well. starts great stinks then finishes great. Just won a WS. Philly doesn't want this OBPS machine back for some reason. Played the last three seasons hurt every game. He is worth a multi year investment.

3. Adam Dunn - Sick, but won't fall. probably shouldn't have put him on.

4. Juan Rivera - disappeared in Anaheim the last two years. but has a few great seasons in him. Will sign cheap too

5. Brad Wilkerson - had a great year once as a NAt. stunk in the AL. worth a minor league deal with a spring training invite

PITCHERS:

Starters:

1. Jason Jennings - could be a steal

2. Mark Mulder - just to see the look on Larussa's face

Relievers:

1. Juan Cruz - rediculously good. but I read nothing on anyone being interested. might be arbitration eligible though...

2. Eric Gagne - only if its a minor league deal

3. Kyle farnsworth - only if its a minor league deal

4. Brandon Donnelly - wears cool rec specs, but only if its a minor league deal

THE NON TENDERS

HITTERS:

IF:

1. Angel Berroa - SS who can step in when we trade Jackie Flash.

2. Ty Wiggington - do we really want to have to remember the Kris Benson trade that never was everyday?

OF:

1. Johny Gomes - Plays his butt off every night. Perfect fit in Pittsburgh. Right handed power bat who can play either corner outfield pos. would provide much needed outfield competition at Spring training.

2. Willy Taveras - Rediculous base stealer who led the majors last year. I would take him over Nyj if the price is right.

PITCHERS:

Starters:

1. Daniel Cabrera - Makes Ian Snell look like Brandon Moss. Headcase who has rediculous stuff, but no self control. I would love to see him in a buccos uni though as he has tremendous stuff and maybe him and Snelly can feed off of eachother.

2. Chuck James - Not sure why he wasn't tendered. This guy would be our number 2 immediately upon arriving.  I'd have him as no 1 but he is a southpaw.

3. Chris Capuano - Injured currently, coming off a second major arm surgery. Was an ace prior to the injury

Relievers:

1. Gary Majewski - Reds traded Austin Kearns because this guy was in the deal. Didn't do much there, but he could be our number 3 lefty out of the pen behind Burnett and Grabow, and if Grabow gets dumped this fills a need

2. Scott proctor - From Untouchable to non-tendered. Could be our 8th inning guy. Power Relief pitcher who fits the NH bullpen mold. Might be a steal.

Jokes

1. Randy Wolf - hey it worked in Astroland.

2. Mark Prior - recently turned down a two year 8 million dollar extension from the DL

www.theonion.com/.../50033

3. We need to make sure PNC Park stays happy.

www.theonion.com/.../50814

4. Matt Herges - so we can trade him for Chris Young

Columbus ... very well put. Don't know if I'd give him a 3-year $25 million contract ... I don't know, that's just $8 million a year (I only make $1 million a year ... just kidding!). But you were very kind to say those things.

If my memory serves me correctly, the Phillies' Ryan Howard had an awful start - maybe worse than Adam. BUT, as Arriba Wilver has pointed out, a lot more talent on the Phillies club to cushion that kind of slump early in the season ... The Pirates season has been pretty much over by June.

JAL--

Thanks for the stats on Nate, I believe a couple of those caught steals were pick offs.

Regarding the 8 hitter, I dont have the stat for Jack hitting 2nd, but I believe he hit considerable better 2nd and I could be wrong, but wasn't his 200 hit year with him hitting 2nd?

And as much as everyone gets frustrated with Big LaRoach, he still has quality stats for a 1st basemen, I believe his stats are very close if not better than Lee for the Cubs.

Jack's situational stats:

sports.yahoo.com/.../situational;_ylt=Ajg4CiFpi0FmeJnuBjWSD6yFCLcF

@Leadoff as you can see he hits the same in the 2 hole as he does in the 8 hole

And I think this past season was the first time he'd been picked off...Nate's very smart on the basepads.  

I am so torn on Adam...I disagree with anyone who says he doesn't care.  I think he does, he's just not one to be demonstrative about it.  He's got a good glove, though I know that doesn't makeup for his slower-than-slow start at the plate in the spring.  We could do better, but I think we could do worse as well.  

I don't know how important consistency in batting coaches is, but I seem to recall a note somewhere that Don Long was at least the 3rd different batting coach he'd had in as many years.  Is it a possibility that him working with Don Long for another season will have a positive affect?

Good afternoon inmates.

JosePagan, I don't think it's the Adam doesn't care. I think he's wired differently. When it comes to Joggin Ronny's not caring and AdLa's not caring, I think Ronny is a bit of a bum. Or was for us at times. Adam is a different ball of wax, that's all.

It does make sense to me that he needs to be on a team in the October hunt, not a team that isn't, if his pattern continues.

Gary Majewski is a right hander. He has been just awful for the Reds, But I agree for the right price he's worth a look.

Maybe the best thing Ramon Vasquez brings to our PBC is his pride in wearing the uniform. If he can instill that pride in our young players, who in their baseball aware lives only know the Pirates as sorry losers, that will be a huge step back to a winning record.

Papa--

I agree, you have to have some pride, DD had that pride, looking back at some of our winning teams of the past you can see a lot of guys that played with pride.

Adam knows he has not started the season normally all the way back to his days with the braves and maybe even longer for all I know.

dam up until this year has never worked the off season.

Adfam was quoted as saying he would nothing differently this winter.

He does not need to keep working out he need to not stop swinging.  what is the big deal to take a few hundred swings a day all winter long to not shut down.

If adam after last seasons start still does not do more this offseason to correct him collectin millions of dollars to look dazed for two months, he does not care.

He may be a nice guy.

Now that Denny B is history, Daniel Cabrera can take his place in Joe Kerrigan's "how to throw strikes" class. He certainly fits NH's power arm mold.

@JJ...I may be wrong, but I seem to recall him saying he started working in the cages he's got at home before ST last season.  

I'm fairly sure he knows his butt's on the line this season if he doesn't produce early.

And he does care...not everyone shows it outwardly.  Like PoH says...he's wired differently.  

DMAC  trhe point is he can not stop hitting after the season is over since to use your wording he is wired differently.

so what hetakes time off stars a little early and still can not hit  he needs to keep his hitting eye alive twelve months a year because of his abnormal wiring harness.

DMAC<his butts on the line this season>  his bat is so critcal to this team that if he does not hit out the gate and he does not hit to save his butt the ending result will be a team with two pitchers hitting in the line up for the start.  We can not hide his bat.  he bats eight  then we got two automatic outs in a row.  forget his total season numbers they mean nothing.  if he did that last off season it did not work and that is my point  something about his eye on the ball tkaes him an abnormally amount of time to see the ball  so, he is hittling the end of the season like he does, common sense trells me to keep swinging all year long to not lose the eye

he does not do that and he does not care, remember when i said this to Fc at the gathering  if adam starts the seaon as he has and he is our firstbaseman we are dead in the water may 1st and FC said you are correct.

JHadar -

>>When a player gets a reputation (like Adam for his slow starts) everything that he does that matches the reputation will be magnified and everything that goes counter to the reputation will be dismissed as an anomaly.<<

I know I am way late getting here today, but when I read this I saw my own thoughts that I expressed here yesterday. Regardless of what Adam does, PERCEPTION IS REALITY and perception is he will fail for the first two months of the season. JAL's stats show he had a quasi-respectable May. Still, DK's article said he did not hit until June. So, it has the appearance that even DK perceived Adam did not do well for the first two months.

JAL -

>>If he is hitting .290 with 23 HR in June then some contender with a hole at 1b may get very interested in him.<<

And that is what I want for Christmas!  ;-)

@JosePagan

You may have been asked this already but here goes.

Are you the Jose Pagan of the late 60"s and early 70's that played for our bucco's?

------------------------

Adam, I think if we look back Adam had a nice spring hitting the ball.  It just stopped after the games counted.

As for his demeanor, he could be read incorrectly.  I know people thought I did not run fast.  Once I heard the other team manager and player say that I was faster than I looked.  Which was true.  Never a burner but faster then you would think.  Height and legs lenght tend to make this illusion.  Now with Adam, some may be that, and also he does not change expressions very much so he is hard to read in that reguard.

With all that said he still needs to hit better early in the season.

All,

Quick question regarding the non-tender of Bautista.

I don't mind losing the guy, he did not appear to possess the control necessary to be successful in the big leagues anyway, but what was the purpose of carrying him on the 40 man roster all the way up to the arbitration deadline and not protecting Kyle Bloom, thus losing him through Rule 5?

If they weren't going to tender Bautista, why not release him a month ago and protect Bloom?

Seems to me that a front office bent on building a championship caliber team through it's farm system would want to retain it's minor league prospects?

In fact, I recall hearing that once somewhere?

NH -- The loss of Kyle Bloom is no big deal.  He had good fall stats, but if you look at his regular season and the reason for his fall stats (playing in a less-skilled league) you probably would have protected someone else -- evidently a Detroit scout was impressed with something and they took a low risk chance on the guy.  We'll probably get him back.

G-Man -- << Perception is reality >> and the winners write the history books.

SirL -- I was limiting my remarks on Adam to the past.  Yes, if he has a good April people will think he's figured it out.  Say he hits .395 in April and then hits .202 in May and goes into June with about a .290 average -- everything will be ok.

Just a question for the regulars -- how do you intend to celebrate once we field a playoff team?

Hostage

That is good question and I do not have an answer to it.  Maybe DK has insight into it.

JH

First I open a 20 or 30 year old bottle of port and have a glass.  Then I find out how to get a ticket to at least one of the playoff games.  Then i come on the blog and stick my tongue out at a couple of people :)  So out practice i haven't planned the rest yet :)

@Graham: You can forget about Farnsworth, he signed with the Royals:

sports.yahoo.com/.../news;_ylt=ApzzE7JOcbR_yq.mL5QqGE6FCLcF

NH- Maybe the Pirates thought he had some throw-in trade value?  Denny was no better than Letroy Hawkins was for the Yankees.  

How would anyone like the start for the Baltimore Orioles at Catcher?  I think the coversation goes like this..

"opening day job is yours.  Once we bring him up May 1st, be sure to stretch out on the bench".  

I second JAL in commending Nutting Hostage for an excellent question. Whether or not the team's opinion of Bloom had been lessening, why lose him when we could have kept him? Or, why risk losing someone else, then? We did waste a spot on the 40-man by keeping Bautista on it, just to release him. The regime should have decided to fish or cut bait, BEFORE the Rule 5 draft -not the day after.

Furthermore, the "we'd like to have Doug back" line we've heard more than once, looks to be just lip service for fans like me. I've seriously gotten the impression that the Regime is actually hoping he's grabbed by someone else. I know, I know --he wants to start, and NH is waiting to see if he has any other offers first. But as DK stated, his agent met with NH in Vegas, but wasn't even given an offer, leading DK to write that Doug's return is looking less and less likely. We can only *hope* that Vazquez's bench presence can approach that of Doug's. But if this is a swap, WHY? We could have the real deal?

Here's hoping Vazquez is to be the replacement for Rivas, or maybe Gomez (but NOT Jack or Freddy --BK: bite your tongue!). Unfortunately for Doug, though (and the rest of us fans who care), Vazquez bats left-handed, as does Doug. Gotta save space for some righties to come off the bench, too. NH looks like he isn't leaving much room for Doug, indeed. This stinks. But my fingers ARE still crossed.

PI- On Farnsworth.. to quote NH "Hot Diggity".  He's a good guy to fill out a staff, but do you really want him in 8th with his history of Bill Wagner-esque titanitc blasts to serve up?  They RAN him out of Atlanta and New York.

@ madturk - no, I am not THE Jose Pagan, but he was one of the Buccos I admired as a kid. I still remember his description in the media guide: "Jose is the jack in the trunk of the Pirates flivver..." I swear the guy played every position but catch, and he may have played that too. I grew up a couple of miles from 3 Rivers and the kids in our neighborhood spent a lot of time at games - those were the days! Baseball games during the day! Doubleheaders were the best! A good seat was anywhere you could see right field...

Fun to see y'all going on about J Wilson. Hard to evaluate how good the guy is statistically considering the crap teams he has played on. No offense, but average talent can be made to look much better when surrounded by above average talent both in fielding and hitting. Would you rather be an infielder behind Sabbathia or behind last season's version of Gorzellany? I suspect that the degree of difficulty on the average fielding chance is higher for a Pirate infielder than for say a Dodger/Phillie you get the picture infielder. Same with hitting. Spend the first few months of the season batting around The Laconic One (A. LaRoche) and you tend to see fewer pitches worth hitting.

Now, I am no expert on the current free agent pool so I will take some of you at your word, nor am I a Wilson apologist. I just don't think he is as useless as some here make him out to be. He IS the kind of guy you want on the team as far as promoting it though. He doesn't embarrass the club on or off the field.

@ NH: From what I have read about Bloom, he seemed to have no upside, so why protect him? He was doing well in a league where he was the oldest pitcher. Management realized, I think that his success was artificial so why waste a spot?

Like they say, there are 3 kinds of lies: a lie, a d*****d lie, and statistics.

Stan,

Re: Starting catcher for the O's... Yeah! Any catcher and his agent should KNOW they're not dealing with straight shooters if that's how the O's pitch the opening (as a "starting position").

Though on the bright side, Arizona Cardinals QB Kurt Warner is having the last laugh, after being jerked around in just that manner by the Giants and then the Cards.

Jal- Regarding Rule 5, I know the Pirates picked 4 guys, and in way have found a way to start to compensate for years on neglect in Latin America.  2 players is a start, but why not take a player in the AA draft too?

I find it curious that Bloom was sent to Hawaii, then wasn't on the 40, but if he wasn't pitching for the Pirates last July when the PBC recalled Herrara,, how ready is for the majors?

I know its easy to be over-exerburant of Veal, but I think what I've read about him.  He had to be in Heck (censored) after the past 2 years and needed a fresh start.  He could be Ollie with pitching sense. .  

Jose,

You're dead on, regarding JW.

As for not protecting Bloom, as I mentioned above, why not? We apparently had the space on the 40 man. Or, again, we could have protected someone else, then. NH should have made up his mind on Bautisata, BEFORE, not the day after, the Rule 5 draft.

Stan,

In the AA part of the draft, I thought we took those three players... or was that something else? I'm not so solid in my overall grasp of the Rule 5 draft and its different phases.

JL- just a thought in general.  Why doesn't EVERY team take a guy in Rule 5? Its not a full-proof way to build a team, but I have to think that the 24th and 25th players on a roster aren't better that what is available.

Surprisingly, half the league passed on the draft.  

Sir L - what fun thinking about your question!  It's like thinking about what you'd do with the money if you won the Lottery.  The answer depends on the year before.  If we come out of nowhere like the Rays did this year after losing the year before - then I don't know what I'd do.  I don't mean that right now I don't know what I'd do - I mean that I would be in a state of mental blotto and rational decisions would not be made for awhile.  

If, however, we had a lead-up year of competitive winning baseball, only to fail to make the playoffs, then I would be a nervous wreck about what was to come.  Flaming out in the first round is not that much fun at the time.

On the other recent subject, it is a very good question indeed about why we had to lose Bloom.  It's not the loss of Bloom so much as why it had to happen.  I hope we get an answer.

JL and WSB

AAA or AA  doesn't make any difference.  Prime role of the minor league draft is to fill out farm teams.  With 40 on main roster, another 38 protected in AAA and and another 30 some in AA there is not much left in promising talent.  Since it costs $4000 for a player in the AA draft there is no reason to take anyone unless you really have hope for him.  These are not the best of minors available.

Jal-great info thanks.

JAL,

Forty, thirty-eight, and thirty. Got it. Thanks.

JL and WSB

Just looked it up and it 37 for AA--

From friends who saw Bloom in Altoona he is apparently a Bullington clone with no future above AA. Any AA pitcher should be successful in the HWL. A 21 or 22 yr old ClassA pitcher who dominates there would be noteworthy Bloom's performance was one of those straws we have all been grasping for the last forever.

By keeping Denny on the 40 roster you hope to give other teams the illusion that he has more value than he does, maybe littlefield might have come after him from Chi. ha ha, but you get the point.

maybe a guy has a sore whatever, you give him a chance to heal without drawing attention that would be undue.

most of the reasons for a move like this are not what they seem to be.

papa

Well put--the HWL numbers are out of hack with his A and AA numbers.  At 25 with a 4.19 ERA in AA not a big loss--and no guarantee the Tigers will keep him on the roster all season.  If he doesn't do much in ST he could back in the Pirate organization by season' start.   Veal may not develop either but he has a higher upside than Bloom.

The only thing that I don't understand about the Bloom situation is.......why we assigned him to the HWL at all. If it wasn’t the appropriate level of competition for him, and he wasn’t very impressive prior to the assignment, then why didn’t we send someone that could benefit from that assignment?

all the words I was thinking did not get typed,  the ssore whatever is not to hide just give him a little extra time before anyone looks his way.

MAybe you send Bloom to the HWL in the hope that some team might be impressed enough to offer you something for him. Just thinkin'

Bloom will not bloom this spring.  The brouhaha about protecting him is a tempest in a teapot.

The Pirates had to know that Bloom would do well in Hawaii. Sending him there and then not protecting him does not make any sense. Unless, there was something wrong with Bloom. A possible physical ailment or even an attitude problem that the Pirates did not want to deal with.

Bloom does good in Hawaii, you leave him unprotected, another team drafts him, problem solved. We will know more if he is offered back to the Pirates and they do not take him. If they take him back, then nothing they did makes any sense.

It would have made more sense to send Alvarez to Hawaii and give Bloom time off.

Well -- it's getting empty in here, think I'll call it a night.  Time for Red Green -- so in the words of the master of Duck tape

Remember I'm pullin' for ya', we're all in this together.

@uglyken wrote re: Morning links: Arbitration season begins

on Dec 13, 2008 10:33 PM

The only thing that I don't understand about the Bloom situation is.......why we assigned him to the HWL at all. If it wasn’t the appropriate level of competition for him, and he wasn’t very impressive prior to the assignment, then why didn’t we send someone that could benefit from that assignment?

He could have been used to diguise someone else we did not want to get noticed as well.  I believe you can only lose 5 players total.  Jal correct me if I am wrong.  So if we were worried about losing a few others why not put someone there to showcase them and get the attention away from others?  Just a thought.

Seems I have a few missing keys on the keyboard..  Oh well.

I hate it when keys disappear on the keyboard.  ;-)

That's a good point, though, Mad...I wonder what NH has planned.

Morning Links and Blog Links are going to be a little late.

Any reason cited?

(Did I post this already?)

Any ideas why?  Do you have an e.t.a.?

(So I _did_ post!)  Sorry for the double.