Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

"Tour of broken dreams" love it -- why have the Brewers been such a nemesis this year, we have played much better against better ball clubs.  Let's hope we break out tonight.

Karma is an interesting thing. After the Astros sweep the Pirates to get close to the wild card. Commissioner Bud torpedoes the Astros by sending them to Milwaukee to play the Cubs, basically making them Cubs home games. Knocking the Astros out of the wild card chase...which would benefit the Brewers....who were leading for the wild card...which he used to own. NO conflict of interest there, is there??

Karma turns around and bites the Brewers in the butt by having them play bad baseball. Now the Pirates can bring things full circle by destroying the Brewers chances. Which I am sure would bring the Astros a little pleasure...but not a lot.

DK-

Be careful in the pressbox...the Brewers' scorekeeper may throw a pencil at your head during the 1st at-bat to avenge the "lost" no-hiiter.  Of course, he/she won't admit to throwing at you though.

Aaaaarrrgh! I'm with you, JHadar. Let's take out a year's frustration of losing to them by backing Karstens with some serious lumber ... predicting we beat them 8-2 ... including three home runs and ropes to the alleys all night long.

Will be checking in with Mrs. Bay throughout the evening on our progress.

Have a good night, all!  

@baywatch or is it Bea Arthur or Ron Jeremy--Have a good evening fighting the pizza wars

JAL -- re: Emmet Kelly's character and the Dodgers -- weren't they pretty well known as 'Dem Bums, which would make Kelly a mascot in the traditional sense.  

Old Joke:  Cabby yells up to the guy in the bleachers at Ebbets field.  "How's Dem Bums Doon?

Guy Yells Back "Tied up in bottom a da ninth an Dem Bums got 3 men on base.

Cabby:  Which Base?

(I think the joke was spawned after an amazing baserunning gaffe where three guys wound up at third and were all out.)  

If this is a tour of broken dreams, surely Federal Street must be the Boulevard of Broken Dreams.

www.youtube.com/watch

G'night, Baywatch. G'night, Pirata13. BillyKidd, time to get up.

@JHadar --The fans referred to them as Dem Bums but that was never their official name--they were the Dodgers.  

August 15, 1926--Billy Herman hit a double that became a double play.  There was one out in the inning so only two were out--Herman for passing Chick Fewster (who started on first) and Fewster because Dazzy Vance (the third runner)  was entitled to the base.

Baywatch, you bird dog you.  I think it flies both ways.

I was wondering if Pedro is in the lineup tonight?

Brandon Moss will not be in the lineup--DK just posted that he has a knee injury

JAL -- waiting out a lightning storm before heading home for the evening and just playing with tthe concept, hope you don't mind -- but Bum sure seems closer to Dodger than Chicken to Padre or Baseball head to Met.

Kind of reminds me of one of those old standardized test questions:  

Dodger is to Bum as White Elephant is to: (a) Chicken (b) A (c) Corneleus McGillicuddy (d) Kansas City (e) Philadelphia

With the loss of Moss

I revise my predicts

Make it 2 home runs

And a couple of broke sticks

Why is it with this club, you're always muttering under your breath "What Next?"  Four-to-six months for an injury he can't even feel, or risk his career if he goes ahead.  Yi!

@G-Man--Hey now...

@JLP--That was amazing.

@Bay-- Catch you on thew late with with JL and JJ.

I guess that's 4-6 months ... as in out-of next season?

If he has the surgery soon, I suppose worst case would be rehab in April and an open spot on the 40-man until he recovers comepletely.

regarding Moss--Isn't that why they have physicals before trades are consumated? Someone on the staff may need to be fired. How can you miss a knee..He admitted that he had issues with it...On the bright side SPearce will get to look at a lot of offspeed pitches to try to improve his avg...

I echo JH's sentiment...What next???

HAPLESS simply HAPLESS

BK -- Also did Boston know about it and not mention before the trade?  

So Moss goes on the 60 day DL - which means his spot on the 40 man roster can is open until he comes off.  Gee, who could we find to place on the 40-man in the meantime????

Didn't Moss have a physical before coming to the Pirates or was the deal put together too late at the deadline?  Shades of Freddy (lost a good year, year and a half after coming over from the Bosox because of injury) and Pat Meares (never recovering after injury/surgery).  Not to be critical.

JH--I was just gettingready to go down that same path...That question has to be asked and answered.

ok- here it starts.

moss is out,  never to get back in due to the smokin' bat of steve pearce. big nite. no no-no tonite.

why NOT pitch cc on 3 days rest- he's not on brew crew next season.

glad to be the ones sinking the brewboat.

Gee, who could we find to place on the 40-man in the meantime????

Barry Bonds on a prorated 1 week salary.

Hey, let's not fault the Red Sox in the Moss knee thing.

I mean, if I've got 2001 Honda for sale that's using oil ... your own mechanic is going to have to let you know.

It's HANSEN that we went for with eyes wide shut ... just smackin' around here, too, they both could work out fine.

Thanks DK but why was this not uncovered during the pretrade physical?

What did they do.  Dr. Magoo asks "Mr. Moss are you breathing". Moss replies Yes last time I checked Dr. Magoo.

Passed!

DK -- then the question becomes whether or not the injury will be aggrevated by normal (for an MLB outfielder) activity or if there is a danger for something just going pop someday and that't that.  Any idea of what the medical risks/consequences of not having the surgery are?

honus wags - I hope you're right, but in watching some of the games this year against the Brewers, not only do their .230 - .240 hitters (ex. Camereon .238) hit about .400 against us, you can see it in their eyes at the plate that they know they are going to hit us.  It seems like Cameron has hit at least 5 of his 25 home runs against the PBC. On the bright side, Karstens didn't do badly against them last time out.  

Bay, there's a big difference between hiding a defect in a transaction and being unaware of it.  Difficult to prove, by all means, and I doubt our remedy would be to get Bay back -- but didn't MLB rules give us a comp pick of some sort a few years back when we picked up an injured player (was it Sanchez?) from Boston?

I have changed my Avatar in honor of the PBC Medical Staff.

DK - thanks.  Should have caught that because you had it up above.  

Bone against bone sounds like it could gradually become what my doctor calls wear & tear arthritis and slow him down some though as time goes on.

BK -- Now the Hostage can't call you Billy Schultz any more either

And Young played first not the outfield.  Get the surgery now if it helps him later.

JH--Yeah it was an empty XL tub of Bazooka Joe bubble gum and 2 baseballs that were used for pepper against the green monster

@JH-I went to the G-Man school of sneaky avatar updates....I am incognito now.

If the doc says surgery then get it--6 months now of maybe a year later.  If now then he will getting back into shape around opening day.  If sooner, and says 4 to 6) he would not miss any playing time except these last few games.

I guess Moss adopted the "Don't ask Don't Tell". Mantra.

If he's getting discomfort on hard surfaces already, they should be at the very least monitoring the rate of cartilage decay.

Looks like the rain and lightning stopped and I can head home.  Small towns, you know, we don't always drive to work.

If Moss does have bone on bone , don't expect a great deal long term from him. The Bay trade just keeps gettin' better and better....fun to watch a pennant race for a change.First one for me ( Bay) since 1997.Nice to root for a team that is actually playing a meaningful game again. Bay trade sets Pirates back a few more years...please, don't give me "wait to judge in a few years!!". Unless Morris is a Cy Young pitcher, it's a disaster.

Moss says, "I know my body, and I know I feel fine."

He's a kid, and he wants to play. The adults need to ship him off to surgerypronto,  and then turn their attention to getting compensation from the Red Sox.

I'd say this injury precludes Moss from ever being the long-term solution to playing left field at PNC. It could well preclude him from playing outfield at all, as it progressively gets worse. We're talking bone on bone, ON THE KNEE, ladies and gentleman.

@JHadar --Dem Bums only to their fans-to everyone else they were the Dodgers.  For example I just did a search of two different months of the Sporting News-June 1939 and June 1950--no mention of Dem Bums.

Dem Bones

www.youtube.com/watch

@JL--<I'd say this injury precludes Moss from ever being the long-term solution to playing left field at PNC>

Get it fixed get it rehabed,  properly, take all the time necessary to do it right. Then lets wee where we are...

moss just turned 25 about a week ago and 'feels his knee' when he goes up steps....I am not a doctor, and I don't play one on tv, but this is another ouchy for the bucs. bad knees on bay last year, now moss.

karstens will put the brew crew in their place. I like the line-up [scholarship for lil laroche accepted]. I think these are the only ones not hurt or pitchers.

did paulino get put in next to  pearce's room under the clemete bridge?

BK,

"Get it fixed..."

I'm no doctor, but I don't believe this is a fixable condition. I believe the surgeons shave down the bone to relieve friction, in this case, but that's about it. Who knows? Maybe they have some new trial procedure they can try out on Moss. But don't be surprised is he starts walking around like Joe Namath.

Seriously, we need to pursue getting further compensation the Red Sox. If Moss told his bosses that he had discomfort on artificial surfaces, I think we have a grounds for a grievance.

Somebody tell Shyam Das, "Keep that docket date open!"

Do what we can with Moss, but get the Red Sox to pony up some more.

@JL--Maybe Pedroia?  :)

I am no Doctor Magoo either. I guess like the PA situation we will just wait and see.

JAL,

Please drop what you're doing and catch the next flight to NY! YOU represent our team at the hearings! (Heck, you could even argue the merits of our case in verse.)

Maybe Moss can be the new 1st baseman when the Regime comes to its senses and trades AdLa.  Young played a lot of 3rd until his knees got too bad if memory serves.

BK,

On the bright side, if you have a relapse and need to be checked into the Nurse Cratchett ward again, Moss might be recovering from surgery in the bed next to you. You could teach him the ways of our Asylum, bring him along, sorta make him our inside man in the Bucs lockerroom. The possibilities are endless...

JAL -- like I said, just having some fun with the concept; but if you Google "Emmet Kelly Brooklyn Dodgers", the first 20 hits all use the word "mascot" and I just didn't check beyond that.  

Usually refers to him being hired as a mascot for the 1956 season.

You were the guy who was on the debate team, right?

I can lend any pitcher that wants to try them my cool glasses.

Since I've seen a couple of references to it here, I will make the comment. I believe that the 60 day DL is only used during the baseball season (Spring Training thru the end of the World Series). Outside of those times, you are either on the 40 man roster or you are not. We wouldn't be able to stash Moss on the 60 day DL during the off-season.

I guess that means Steven Pearce has 6 days to escape his crypt under the Clemente Bridge by getting hot. I see no earthly reason why he  shouldn't start EVERY game between now and Sunday. Morgan or no Morgan.

@JHadar--I am just having fun too.  I love good little debate on something fun.  Emmet Kelly was 20 hits in row is not enough my friend--have to get 57 to set a new record :)

I debated 4 year in college and then coached debate for 10 years.  Lots of good times there.

@Thunder--I agree, but I bet that Michaels will get 2 games. Maybe 3 (every other day, platoon) If he hits he stays in the lineup.

Anyone catch Rob Neyer's take on Jack's farewell the other day?

insider.espn.go.com/.../index

This is one of the first things I've read by him that irritated me.  Jack has been here giving the fans all that he can over the years, however he doesn't want us to show our appreciation when he could be leaving.

@JL--would love to argue the case--be quicker for me to take the train-puts me right in the middle of Manhattan and is faster than going through airports and then still getting transport to Manhattan.  

JAL -- This was interesting from Wikipedia

“Dem Bums”

By the late 1930s, the Dodgers had earned the reputation of loveable losers. One day in 1939, sports cartoonist Willard Mullin of the New York World Telegram asked a cab driver how the Dodgers were doing. The cabbie replied, “Dem Bums are bums.” The encounter gave Mullin an idea, and he soon developed a cartoon character, the “Brooklyn Bum,” to symbolize the team. Fans and newspapers alike, mimmicking a Brooklyn accent, often referred to the team as “Dem Bums.” Even circus clown Emmett Kelly, who had created the hobo character, “Weeping Willie,” for the Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus, got into the act, often appearing at Ebbets Field as the Dodgers unofficial mascot.

@BK...if Michaels gets 2 games...there's no reason Pearce can't play at least one of those at 1B. Is there any reason Adam HAS to play every game if his hamstring gets healthy between now and Sunday?

Sorry I didn't get a chance to ask this question yesterday,but : does any one in here watch " The Golden Age Of Baseball " on FSN Sundays ? And if so,did you see the piece on # 21 this past Sunday ? It was short,but terrific.I love that show anyway,it always gives me a severe case of nostalgia ! Oh to be 12 -16 again...

@JHadar--It is interesting and it closes the debate-look at the words--unofficial mascot.  So here how the debate ends--there was at least one unofficial mascot prior to 1974 when the first official mascot came on the scene.  I see this a tie though may claim victory if you desire based on the fact that the original post did not use the word official.  :)

Nyger!!!!

1/2 inning - 2 errors. Brewers scorer being unfriendly? Or are they legit?

Bad news from game--Nate just got first error (throwing), probably lost chance for gold glove, Milwaukee leads by 2

Good news--after 2 consecutive errors by Morgan and Nate, respectively, and 2 runs, Karstens struck out Fielder and Hardy

@BattlinBucs --I just read the piece.  Neyer does not see beyond the stats.  Also, as he says, no one ready to play SS at close to Wilson's level.  One option Pirates have is to trade Wilson and pick up a FA agent SS who will play around Wilson's level for less money--say an Alex Cintron or Nick Punto

I hope that Matt Capps will have an opportunity to strike out the "Clown Prince" to end one of these games. Karma...

JAL -- Wow, you give no quarter.  The Wiki reference was about his "unofficial" appearances in the 30's & 40's.  I thought we were done.

Here from the Ringling Bros. Site -- note the reference to his "job as the mascot."  

Willie provided comic relief in the Circus through the end of the 1956 season when he left his Circus career to pursue a job as the mascot for the Brooklyn Dodgers.

Now, your research please? :-]

And speaking of clowns -- 2 runs, 2 errors, 0 ER?

Arrrgh

well on a positive note that triple by braun really helps me out for championship week in my fantasy leage. but as for nate errors or not he is not a gold glove outfielder. he seems to misplay balls from time to time which dont show up as errors but still hurt the team. he had an embarrasing miscue sunday as well.

BillyKidd wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 7:32 PM

Get it fixed get it rehabed,  properly, take all the time necessary to do it right. Then lets wee where we are...

I hope that's a typo or are you marking your territory?

Not a real goos start to the game for the defense.

They were legit errors.

Arrrgh...... life on the Pirateship, if the scurvy don't get ya the pox will.

I hate the idea that Wilson might be gone soon but as a business decision its a good one. Carrying a 7.5 mil SS on a rebuilding project doesn't help.  If we can get a good prospect back we need to make the move.  Next year is not going to be our year so save the cash until we have the young players ready to take the next step.  Then we will see how true to his word Nutting is.

Can Nyjer redeem himself?

JAL- Both Punto and Cintron put up very similar numbers this year to jack

Nick Punto .283 2 HRs 27 RBIs

Alex Cintron  .280 1HR 10 RBI (Spent a month on the DL and started the year in the minors)

But neither of these can really fill the void if jack were to leave

@mad--After I hit ADD I saw it and started laughing..

Reminiscent of Saturday Night.

Atta boy !!!!!

Bush was having control issues.

@JHadar  --No quarter but a 50 cent piece (do they still make them?)--

NY Times-January 29, 1957

"The saddest of all bums joined "Dem Bums,"  the Brooklyn Dodgers yesterday.

Walter O'Malley, the Dodgers president, signed Emmett Kelly, the former tramp clown of Ringling Brothers and Barnum & Bailey Circus, to do his Chaplinesque pantomimes at Ebbets Field and with some farm clubs."

However, the story never refers to him as a mascot and compares him to former "baseball clowns' Al Schacht and Nick Altrock.

Well, that's better.

After a 4 pitch walk, two outs, to Karstens loading the bases, Nyjer ties up game with a single, followed by a run-scoring game leading single by Freddy.

3-2 Bucs.  

I really do not like Counsell

@BK--Now you knew this was coming after your last post :)

www.youtube.com/watch

@JHadar-Hope you had as much fun this as I did

BK- You took the words right out of my mouth on Counsell.  On the other hand, he always seems to be on a different team every year, but it is always one that is at least contending for the post-season.

Random thought--Does anyone else look at Bush batting and think,"I would hire that guy to do my taxes.?"

JAL -- Leaving it out of one story doesn't mean it wasn't there, putting it in lots of them does.  Clown and Mascot are not mutually exclusive terms.

Meanwhile the game has become much more interesting.

Doesn't seem like Counsell has been playing since the deadball era?

JHadar--Quite true--they are not mutually exclusive.  NY Times April 18, 1957

John Cashmore will throw out the first ball and Emmett Kelly, of circus fame, will make his championship debut as the meandering mascot of the Dodgers

JAL -- I'll take that as a concession -- but well played.

@JAL--One of my fav's as a 13 yo...Thanks Oh what great memories.

S-A-T-U-R-D-AY Night!

@JAL--I just looked it up I was 11. jeez

I am starting to wonder if Pearce is ready.Every time I see him flail at an off speed pitch it makes me think that he struggles unless it's a fast ball

At least through 3, Karstens is throwing strikes.  Two more strikeouts in 3rd.  Realistically, the Brewers look tight; Fielder just flailed at two out-of-the-strike zone pitches to strike out.  But, whatever, it's working so far.

JHadar--Well played on your end too--yes, concession it was-or is.

@BK--Glad you enjoyed it.  11--I wonder if I was 11 once :)

@Arriba--He is like that little gnat that keeps buzzing around your head.

I have no clue how every year with that absurd stance hekeeps endng up on winning teams. I know there have been other players with a similar stance, but his annoys me in particular. My 9 yo looks bigger than him, Shocker, MLB has him listed at 6' 180lbs...Yeah maybe in Stiletto heels and catchers gear. now there is an image for you.

@maz--I have doubts about whether he will ever be ready.  Fielder is year younger than Pearce and he has been a regular for 3 years with 28, 50, and 33 so far this season.  We can hope he will a bit like Ryan Howard--his first full season was at 26 with 22 HR--then he hit 58, 47, and 46.

@JAL--Not a worry in the world. And to think back then we could not wait to be an adult.

 Is it just me or would anyone else love to see the Bucs take at least 2 out of 3 and have htese cocky clowns pull out their shirts Thursday afternnon because the season is essentially over for them?

BK -- Now a new Magoo too.  Looks like I'm going to have to start deleting my temp files every 10 minutes just to keep up with everyone.

You know, I've been trying to wait 'til spring to form any opinions on next year's line-up, but if Morgan keeps hitting like this and could learn to run the bases we may have our next break out guy.

I hear ya, BK.  

Nyjer is looking pretty good.  2 AB's, 2 hits, 2 RBI's, 1 SB.  And to top it all off (forgetting about the error) his steal of 2B ended at 2B, not halfway to short.

@JAL/Arriba--If he bats against CC, he is going to be embarassed badly.  

@goduquesne12--took me awhile to get to you.  Yes, the point I was making is that are similar to Wilson in offensive production and should cost less.  But there is more to a player than stats.  

This started with avatar change day but I think it has morphed into avatar change month

BK- him and 95% of the rest of the league.  I have become a CC believer.  I think the guy whose first name begins with J and last name begins with B and ends in a Y had trouble with CC.

It is all Baywatch's fault...That may be my last one for a couple of weeks.

@JH--I like the BlacknWhite images.

Karstens is looking Ok he just needs a little more consistancy. And no more changeups to the backstop.

@JAL/Goduq13--Cintron is intriguing if he is healthy.

Anyone know where Nate actually stands now in the whole conversation for the gold glove. I really hope he gets it and if they give it to someone just cuz they on a winning team, thats just not fair and Nate's worked his butt off and deserves it.

Top of 6th, Stevie P leads off with a single and steals second.  No mistake, he stole 2B.  Speculation is it was a hit and run and Kendall couldn't throw him out.

ONe of the talking heads It may have been Brown. Said he thought Nate would be a candidate, JR said if he was able he would vote for him (cant vote for your own)., but feel because he is on a losing team will get over looked.

Is it just the managers that vote; I think Nate would have a better chance with them than with writers (that Boston, NY, Chi, LA thing), and certainly a much better chance than with range-factor guys.

@Arriba Wilver...actually that SB was Pearce's 2nd of the season and 4th in the majors. He's 4 out of 5...80%...which is actually better than Nyjer.

@JH--I pulled this out of an article from the web

A misconception is that writers vote for Gold Gloves. They do not. Managers and coaches do. And they cannot vote for players on their own team.

@buc-ct--There are no standings because the gold glove is voted on by managers and coaches.  They give three to outfielders and they do not have to be by position.  If enough coaches and managers think he is one of the 3 best defensove OF in te league he will win a GG, if not he won't.  On fielding pct going into tonight there were two CF with 1000 FP, no RF with 1000, and 1 LF with 1000

Thank you DK.

Thunder--thanks for the stat. I was just headed to look for that.

Red Sox won tonight so the Yankees are out of the playoffs for the first time in many a year.

@BK--We posted close to same info at about the same time.

Wow, Karstens looking good thru 6; hopefully Gagne will self-destruct like he has a habit of doing......

Is the Randall Simon sausage incident the number 1 thing the Pirates are known for the past 16 years?

Boy would it be wonderful for NyjMo to bring this bat with him to Bradenton, I flat out just like him. I am hoping he is coming into his own, albeit a little late...Nice break up of the DP.

I wish I wasn't so lazy.  Because I'd really like to take the time to look at what Nyjer has done for this offense since he was called back up.  I'm curious about the batting average of players when he is base.  And I'm even more curious about his run share.  Mistakes aside, he really seem to generate a good bit of offense, and we all know he has a good glove.

@BK; As long as he learns to not overslide a base.....

@JAL--Other than the fact we haven't done squawdoosh in between the lines for 16 years...Yep

@PI--yes, and that is something that can be taught and hopefully learned.

Karstens very good tonight.Throwing in the low 90s at times.Mixing pitches up very well.Kinda like Duke when he first came up.87p-62 st

@Thunder wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Tue, Sep 23 2008 9:58 PM

@Arriba Wilver...actually that SB was Pearce's 2nd of the season and 4th in the majors. He's 4 out of 5...80%...which is actually better than Nyjer.

Yes and he did not over slide the base either.

@JAL--Does Hank dump Giradi? Tomorrow.

@maz--6 innings -no earned runs-6 strikeouts-87 pitches--I would call that a very good outing.

Looks like is up to the Bullpen now.....which BP will show up for the Bucs tonight????

With all of those white towles waving I thought I was at the Igloo for a moment.

@meestro wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 10:10 PM

I wish I wasn't so lazy.  Because I'd really like to take the time to look at what Nyjer has done for this offense since he was called back up.  I'm curious about the batting average of players when he is base.  And I'm even more curious about his run share.  Mistakes aside, he really seem to generate a good bit of offense, and we all know he has a good glove.

Nyjer is not an everyday player.  Except on a losing team.  No power! too many mistakes. Too old to start learning on the job.

Glad he is doing well right now though.

How does Chavez hang that ball over the plate like that? Dumb. When he had a pitchers count. Dumb.

Guess Chavez answered my last post.....

@BK--I don't think so--Hank seems to realize the Yanks have some problems beyond the manager's control.  Probably give him another season.

I see it took the pen no time at all to give up the lead.

@PI-- not the winning one...

Did it look like Jeffy was reading the riot act to Chavez?  

Besides the sausage assault, there's the freak show, and Lloyd stealing first base.

Not sure why the Pirates didn't have Morgan play closer to the line with Cameron, a righty, batting, to guard against just what happened. Oh well, water under the bridge.

Too bad we couldn't get Karstens the win. No one is happier than me that Karsty the Klown didn't show up today. I will keep my avatar the same for a while, for the good luck. It keeps Karsty away and summons the real Jeff Karstens to the mound.

@BK; Let's hope not, still got 6 outs......get out the rally caps!

@mad--He has pretty much guaranteed himself to be the incumbant LF next year. I see no one pushing him out.

Moss with the knee is now a definite ? mark

Pearce has to learn to hit MLB pitchers

Duffy He may be the RF if he can stay healthy.

Tabata Will probably start in Indy

I think he will do just fine starting in LF.

@JL--Good move--keep Karsty here--not on the field.

A BOMB by SP with DD on 1B way to go, Steve.

Will we see our old friend Torres tonight????

After all the Pearce post tonight-boom--now back to pen.

a walk and a Pearce HR another lead so let's put Hansen in the game.  Nah I want to sweep them.

Wow....What a blast by Pearce!!!!!!!!!

MEMO

To:  Neal Huntington, Frank Coonelly

From:  Assorted Pittsburgh Pirate Fans, a special and vanishing breed

Date:  9/23/08

RE:  Pitching

We have been watching our overmatched youngsters once again play their hearts out against a superior opponent, having come back from a couple of devastating errors in the first inning to take a 3-2 lead.  We have since remained hopeful up until the 7th inning when our bullpen once again suffered a meltdown, taking a possible win from a rookie starter that we would very much like to support.

This has happened quite a bit recently.  It is discouraging to those of us who follow the game closely, and devastating to more casual observer.  So much so that it is driving many of them away from the ballpark.  You have probably noticed this in this year's attendance figures.

It is our sincere hope that in the upcoming off season you will find some way to correct this glaring deficiency.  While we hope that with the two remaining innings our young team can come back, we hope that you will nonetheless realize how demoralizing it is not to be able to trust your relievers.  

Thank you for your kind attention to this serious matter, we are looking forward to spring training.

STEVE PEARCE

STEVE PEARCE

@BillyKidd

For me that is the scary part.  We have nothing better at this time.  I hope he learns enough and keeps LF warm for the youngters.

PI Stingray wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 10:40 PM

Wow....What a blast by Pearce!!!!!!!!!

Yes it's what we need.  Now if he can learn to hit the soft stuff we have a player.

Ah, it's good to send a memo.   That's the Pearce we were looking for.

Pearce hits his second homer of the year (career?), driving in Dirty Doug, on with a walk.  5-4 Bucs

I was not being critical of Pearce on his  SB,but,c'mon, he's no Nyjer in that area.  Plus,I like him as a potential replacement for AdLa. Let him battle it out with Moss.

Karstens is out, and had a great outing.  Looking at 2009.

@JAL--Maybe we need to pick a player to Flame each night and they will do well?

No soone than I typed this <Pearce has to learn to hit MLB pitchers> and BOOM! PPPPPPPPPPEARCE in my best GBrown

JAL wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 10:40 PM

After all the Pearce post tonight-boom--now back to pen.

Isn't that what happens to him after he hits a Hr?

Why is it that the pitchers that lose leads get the carrot. Baseball one of those sports where you play lousy(Chavez) and you get rewarded with a chance to win a game.Baseball also one of those sports where you make an official look bad(especially home ump) and they retaliate by calling anything remotely close a strike

Mota served up some french pastry.2 other line drive outs.Good HR,but that was a BP pitch.

I will say this about pearce, when he hits it out it looks effortless.

I hate whenever J Kendall does anything to help beat the Bucs, and he just drove in the tying run

I go get a cup of coffe and come back to see Kendall hit a ball harder than I have ever see him hit a ball and to the opposite field, with SP chasing after it like a little leaguer with his arm stretched out. HAPLESS

The play in right just proves that Pearce needs to be at first base.  I like him but not as an outfielder.  I have mentioned this before so I am not bashing Pearce. Either that or get him more time in the outfiled so he learns to play it better.  Although that hit not many would have tracked down the way they were playing Kendall.

@madturk2008  I see that what I wrote could be taken two ways--I was referring to giving the lead back to the bullpen.  Actually, with Moss out we may see Pearce the rest of the way- unless JR decides to platoon Michaels with him.

Once again. no sooner do they get the lead than pen gives it back

Why have Pirates outfielders been way out of position tonight?? Pearce's gaffe was at least the 3rd time tonight where positioning didn't make sense based on pitch selection. Morgan's was worse, but Pearce doesn't have Morgan's speed to make up the difference.

There goes that BP again....maybe they think it stands for batting practice instead of bullpen.....

It has been known I think morgan, too old to still be called a prospect by some can progress at this point.  

Remember this about him so far , he still has not slapped the ball.

You can see infielders making the play on one of his grounders and he almost beats them out.

He puts that ball straight down to the ground and he is going to beat a ball sout for hits.

he is showing he can hit good pitching and has good bat control, I think he has very good potential even at ht his old age.

What's with Nate? Goes all year without an error, then has 2 in one game.......

@JAL

Yes indeed it could be taken two ways.

I was thinking that the last time he hit one they benched him.

I do see it the other way now.

Nyjmo being Nyjmo, as only he can!!

Thunder--Not sure you could blame that on SP being out of position. JK got lucky on a bad pitch by Grawbow.

Thunder wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 10:59 PM

Why have Pirates outfielders been way out of position tonight?? Pearce's gaffe was at least the 3rd time tonight where positioning didn't make sense based on pitch selection. Morgan's was worse, but Pearce doesn't have Morgan's speed to make up the difference.

They have made this mistake with Kendall the last time we played them as well.  They play the outfiled short, not thinking he has any power anymore.  History is repeating itself.  Players not learning and JR or whomever positions the outfield is not learning.

Let's see if we can touch up our old friend Salomon!!!!

McClouth could hit 30 next year.  if morgan does not hit one, who cares if he is in center or left when you got one 30 producer it becomes the responsability of the other corner spot to have some pop in his bat.

Baywatch,  I like the ring you give to my line now that the starters o are out of the game:  We took a magic karstends ride tonight, yea, send that email now.

BK -

That's what you get for drinking coffee...

Heh.

jersey joe wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 11:06 PM

McClouth could hit 30 next year.  if morgan does not hit one, who cares if he is in center or left when you got one 30 producer it becomes the responsability of the other corner spot to have some pop in his bat.

I rather have 15 to 20 in each corner.  Besides it will help keep teams from pitching around the one player that can hit one out.  If that happens you have lost a lot in a lineup that now can be countered by opposing teams.

T J strikes out Cameron.  That hasn't been done very many times by the PBC.

Ah crap the shirts are out.  I am going to bed.

why no Capps?

NO DUFFY

NO DUFFY

NO DUFFY

Please STOP the Duffy talk!

Although it didn't work out, JR was right to leave TJ in to pitch to Fielder based on how T J had been pitching.

Why do you let their biggest power hitter beat you?

That ball just crossed the International Date Line and it is still going. The Russins have just scrambled their Fighters....Middle of the plate belt high slider....Dumb and HAPLESS.

@Thunder; Cause you're the Pirates......

Thunder wrote re: Today: Pirates-Brewers, 9-23-08; Moss' knee injury ends season

on Sep 23, 2008 11:20 PM

Why do you let their biggest power hitter beat you?

I thought they would pitch around him at least to see if he would chase.  Not give him anything to hit....  Bad choice just like the last time again.

@Arriba Wilver

Yes he was pitching well.  See comments to Thunder directly above.

@Cfor2-As much as I wanted a cocktail or glass of Shiraz earlier...I want the whole bottle after that debacle....But no I am on prescription meds...need to be a good boy.

Capps was rested.No reason not to have him in.Another questionable pitching replacement.There is a reason why Capps is your closer.That's like the Yankees not putting Rivera in.You just do not do that

Wonder what JR will say after this?Your closer trying to finish a lousy team year and he sits in the pen.*%~+&$%#@  Russell!!!!!!!!!!

Wonderful work (NOT) by the pen--Karstens goes 6 giving up no earned and the pen gives up 5 in 2 and 2/3 innings.  A lot of talk about who will play in the field next year the major need of the Pirates is pitchers who throw strikes and get people out.  Even a very good hitting team rarely wins when they give up 7 runs.

Look at today's games--Yankees won with 3, KC, Boston, and Tampa with 5, Atlanta with 3, Cinn. with 2.  In only 6 of 16 games did a team score 7 or more.  

Well, we're still hapless. But at least we weren't pathetic. Made the Brew Crew work for it, tonight. I'll take small victories where I can find them (since it's so hard to get a genuine victory).

Four hits for Nyjer, key homer from Pearce, and Jeff Karstens showed up for the first time in seven games. All that's left now is to...

RE-SIGN DOUG MIENTKIEWICZ!!!

(You didn't think I'd forgotten, did you?)

@mazfromiowa

We did not have the lead.  No Caps until we got the lead.

TJ pitched well except for the one over the plate.  This goes on JR for pitching to Prince.  He beat us the last time we played them.  Why pitch to him?  Not smart!  There's a guy on second already so any hit would score him.  1st was open walk him and set up for an any base out.