Classical Musings - All Comments

re: Your take: Do singers=musicians?

Alison Fujito — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 22:22:32 GMT

It's not always easy to move on when a colleague (or even many colleagues) are crabby or uppity, although it's probably the best thing to do.

In defense of Meestro, I do think it might have been more accurate to divide the musicians into singers and instrumentalists, rather than singers and musicians.

But I also agree with Andy that we can't reserve the term "musician" to apply only to those of a certain level.

One of the best musicians I ever knew never played an instrument.

His name was Edward Solomon, and he was my next-door-neighbor when I was growing up. He played the radio, and I swear, he knew EVERY classical piece that was ever played on the radio.

He was an avid gardener, and he was always out in the yard, pruning shrubs, weeding, and blasting WFMT.

He also liked to listen to me practice, which was a good thing, as we didn't have air conditioning, and I practiced 4 hours a day in high school.

I did not come from a musical family, and my mother pretty much left me alone to practice, except she had a few ground rules. One of those rules was that I had to start with scales, then exercises, then etudes, and only THEN the fun stuff (whatever concerto and concert piece I was working on).

I was pretty good,--except when she was out of the house.

I remember one time in particular, when I was about 15 or 16. She left to go grocery shopping, and as soon as she backed out the driveway, I put my copy of the Sibelius violin concerto (which was NOT part of my lesson, being way too difficult for me, but I had managed to find a copy of the music in a a large book by Alberto Bachman) on the stand, and got to work.

As soon as her car rolled back into the driveway, I went back (as usual) to scales and arpeggios, like a good girl.

Outside, while my mom unloaded the groceries, Mr. Solomon leaned on his spade, and remarked in his slow, thoughtful way, "so, Alison's learning Sibelius--isn't that nice?"

I was busted.

re: Your take: Do singers=musicians?

Andrew Druckenbrod — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 14:57:56 GMT

Amen to that, Alison.

The other question is, who are these people who denigrate singers? How many really exist any more? Is this more a case of "should police" in the mind of insecure singers than reality (not to call Eric insecure, but you know what I mean)?

And if a singer does run into some crabby or uppity horn player or violinist who thinks singers are not musicians, or thinks singers are not at the same level as an instrumentalists, why can't singers just call them jerks (and insecure themselves) and move on?

re: Your take: Do singers=musicians?

Alison Fujito — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 22:07:11 GMT

In college, my room-mate's boyfriend had a T-shirt that read,

"If I don't make it in music, I can always try singing."

Nasty, nasty.

On a personal note, I don't think there's any question: of course singers qualify as musicians! Their voice is their instrument.

And what do they sing? MUSIC.

re: Google and Stravinsky

Alison Fujito — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 22:04:16 GMT

Boy, do I feel stupid--I SAW the Google logo today, and wondered what it was about! (I didn't realize today was Stravinsky's birthday.)

Happy Birthday, Igor!

re: Your take: Do singers=musicians?

yue — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 15:10:53 GMT

However, to say that a vocalist of less than perfect musicality (that is being kind) is anything less than a musician is like saying a poor pianist is something less than a musician. You would NEVER say that any lesser pianist, even(especially?) a child just learning, is not a musician, so you should not say that any vocalist/singer (however old) who has not had much instruction is less than a musician.

Vocalists and instrumentalists are both types of musicians. It just so happens that instrumentalists often study harder and longer to master their machines of music (their instruments), while vocalists often are able to produce a pleasing sound with little formal instruction (or even no formal instruction).

The most accurate rewrite of the prickly sentence is probably more like: "110 instrumentalists and 150 vocalists."

When we use those terms we all understand that the people in question are musicians, but 110 of them play an instrument and 150 of them use their larynx.

re: Your take: Do singers=musicians?

Andrew Druckenbrod — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 02:07:37 GMT

Meestro,

Yours is an angle I had not thought of. At the core, you are reserving the word musician -- applying it to singers based on your or someone's evaluation. It they are a certain level, they are musicians.

But this opens up a huge can of worms because who makes that evaluation and what is the criteria? I think it's problematic within our culture and also between cultures. And then also, doesn't what you suggest just go back to the original issue that Eric and others have? I mean, what if a snooty critic :-) or conductor or even a virtuoso violinist simply felt that singers never work hard enough or master rhythm and intonation to the level they have on, and therefore they don't consider the singers musicians based on that criteria? Doesn't that put you back to the original prejudice? I still support my "we are singers and that implies musicianship" take on this. But I love this dialogue. Round up more of your Mendelssohn colleagues and let's get some more feedback on this.

re: Your take: Do Singers=musicians?

meestro — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 00:58:52 GMT

As a member of the Mendelssohn Choir, I'd be happy to offer my input.

At the time when I read your review I had no issue with the wording, but your friend does make a good point. And after thinking it over, I find myself convinced that it would have been better to say "110 instrumentalists and 150 singers", or simply "260 musicians", as opposed to what was actually written.

I think the reason for this is due to the nature of the human voice as an instrument. You aren't born a violin prodigy. It takes years and years of work. But you CAN be born with a good voice. And in this age of American Idol and YouTube, I have seen many people who can sing despite the fact that they probably know nothing about music. I would not hesitate to call these people singers, but I'd be very hesitant to call them musicians. "Musician" for me has always implied study and practice. Those prerequisites don't exist in order to be considered a "singer". To be considered a singer, you just have to have a good voice, and you have to use it. Those are the only prerequisites in my mind.

All 148 choir members on that stage are musicians. Betsy Burleigh wouldn't accept them into the choir if they weren't. I would have no issue with your wording had you called everyone musicians, or had you called nobody musicians. But by only calling the instrumentalists musicians, the simple nature of the word "singer" allows the reader to question whether or not all of these singers really are musicians.

Simply put, in my eyes, not all singers are musicians.

re: Major league angst

meestro — Fri, 12 Jun 2009 08:37:53 GMT

I assure you most of the musicians are thinking the same thing. Performing Mahler 2 was the motivation I needed to finally join the Mendelssohn choir this year. And now, I'll be forced to miss most of game 7 because of it. But if what I heard tonight, at our last full rehearsal, is any indication, I'd like to think that the audience will have completely forgotten about the Penguins by the time this piece reaches its climax.

Of course, I still imagine a mass-musician-exodus to the bar at Bravo Franco afterward though.

Enjoy the concert everyone!

re: PSO arrives in Taiwan

loscil — Wed, 20 May 2009 04:06:02 GMT

Thanks for the great coverage Andrew...it's almost like being there!

re: PSO dedication in last weekend's concerts

zangsir — Sun, 26 Apr 2009 04:15:23 GMT

Hi Andrew, I just saw your review for the PSCO concert, and I didn't know it was the last concert--i thought it was just the last of this season. I really hope it will be back some time because this is so wonderful, just as you said, being in Carnegie Music Hall, seeing a smaller group of musicians, and the Beethoven piano concerto no.1 is definitely so much better than the one that I saw in New York, Biss playing with NYP.