Stull, Wannstedt looking good for Pitt

In a pre-game poll among friends, mostly Pitt fans, I predicted a 31-27 win mentioning that Clausen would lead a 4th quarter comeback.  I'm glad that I lost  the poll because Pitt was deserving ... it seemed the loss of Aaron Berry really had an adverse effect.

We may have seen the 2 best receivers in college on the field tonight.

in the year 2030, the 97 year old blogger Bob Smizik will start his story by saying "Back in 2009, Bill Stull was booed".  Just can't let that go, you are a one trick pony.

(Talk about one-trick ponies, PittNH. Have you ever offered anything but discouraging words on this blog? Or dishonestly distort my words?

As far as Stull, I went easy. I could have rehashed the ABC report that showed Stull's parents prefer not to sit in their seats so as not to hear what the ``fans'' have to say about their son.  --- Bob Smizik)

Aw, leave Bob alone.

But, over on the Pitt blog, Paul Zeise was fairly critical of Bill Stull's performance in the first half.

Pitt is IT!

Baldwin is for real....Sergio Brown is Sportscenter compost .... and BOB, as for the pantheon of Pittsburgh sports "villification," Stull and Wannstedt were and are still a LONG ways back of Barry and Kordell.

Penn State ... ah, shucks

Bob,your headline should have been edited to read  : "Stull,Wannstadt,and the Big East Officiating Crew Looking Good For Pitt ". What a stellar show THEY put on last night !

Great win for Pitt.  OUr D line is a monsterous......

now on to Bobs favorite subject....

This Stull booing is getting rediculous.  They did a little story beside his parents last night saying how they don't sit in their seats do to their son being boo'd........  I don't/didn't agree with the booing, but toughen up and move on......this goes for you too Bob.

Lion -

How did the officials put on a show for us.....explain?  Normally I ignore everything you say due to it nonsensicle nature, but I am curious here.

Just exactly as I'd stated in your earlier blog, Bob (the one in which you asserted, "....Pitt has a better coach. The Panthers should win by a comfortable margin"),  "He (Wannstedt) is prone to tightening up and going ultra-vanilla as the game gets bigger.   Let's see what he does vs. Notre Dame.  I very highly doubt it'll be by a comfortable margin."

Indeed, what could have and should have been a blowout turned into an extreme nailbiter, thanks to Wannstedt ultra, and overly, conservative coaching.   There were multiple times Pitt had an opportunity to TAKE a SMALL RISK by going for it on 4th down and SHORT, but instead Wannstedt, every time,  punted instead.      (prime example -- 4th & 3 at the ND 36, 1 minute left in the half, ND had only 2 TOs, and Wannsted punts instead of going for the jugular.)   I will give Wannstache credit for the almost total lack of penalties by his club last nite.  I believe they had 1 the entire evening, on an encroachment.   That was impressive, given all the punts and KO returns that often result in blocks to the back, plus all the plays that could potentially have had interference or false starts.   1 flag all nite shows good discipline.  

Let's not fawn too much over Billy Stull, either.    I assume you watched the game??   If Baldwin doesn't make, oh, literally FOUR circus catches (catches that Lynn Swann would have had difficulty making in his heyday), ND likely wins the game.   Stull was timid and scattershot the entire evening.   I wouldn't praise and adulate too much over the guy for a rather mediocre evening.  

(I believe I said Stull didn't have his best game and was ``good enough,'' which he was. I assume you read the blog?? -- Bob Smizik)

By the way, Wannstedt talked ALL week about how "Golden Tate was the most dangerous guy we'll face".    

Why, then, with a lead in the 4th quarter, would you even punt the ball to the guy????   WHY ??    Why not settle for a 35-yard punt that LANDS out of bounds??    The line of scrimmage for the punt was the Pitt 43, which is nice field position.  Any pooch punt for 30 or 35 yards requires ND to march roughly 70-75 yards for a score.

This was stone stupid, no matter how Wannstedt or anyone else might try to rationalize it.  

BFD : are you sure you aren't from Arkansas or Mississippi ? Is any one but you ever correct about anything ? Especially with word usage and spelling ....

Lion 43,  They reviewed the play in slow mo and saw the ball come out, after which his wrist pushed it forward.

Everybody else, did I miss something? I thought Pitt just beat NOTRE DAME! Would complain about how Charlize Theron wore her hair if she showed up on your doorstep?

post-game interview revealed that the Pitt punter was supposed to do a rugby style punt just like he did the previous time, but he kind of panicked because of a low snap .. and ended up kicking the ball right in the middle of the field.  Note that most of the coverage team was on the right  side of the field (PItt's right), and Tate went towards the opposite side.

Officials rarely determine a game's outcome.  Good teams overcome them when necessary.  And that was true in this one.  Still, why would the Big East assign a  crew with a white hat who grew up, lives, works in downtown Pitt?  Generally, it was a poorly officiated game, notably halted by too many late "go upstairs and take a look call."  

And you have to wonder what they were watching on the last one ...the ND 3rd down call they gave to Pitt on a fumble, which under the same close inspection seen by the officials, was clearly an incomplete forward pass.  If Weis needs one major issue on which to hang his hat, have at this one.  Took away one final down when the game was on the line.  And it was so very obvious.

Was cool that the announcers noted Stull's poor parents cast to the outskirts of the stadium by the boo birds. You just gotta love the season-long last laugh their son is gifting them.

I concur.  He's not one of the 2 best college receivers yet, but he is pretty doggone good.  Jon Baldwin.  . You'd have to believe he's gone after this season. While he still drops too many gimmes,  he's improving and as we saw, has the capacity to make the big one.  Looking at his silly mohawkish mullet 'do, someones ought to suggest a new Aliquippa hairstylist. And with his lanky 6'5" frame, jumping athleticism, and silly mohawkish mullet  no doubt given freely from some Aliquippa beautician ...well you gotta wonder if Balwin might be the next Burress.  

Even with nice perfs from both the O and D Pitt lines ...watching the remnants of a once proud Irish kingdom was sad, pathetic.  ND is really a lousy program.  Which deep-pocketed leprechaun will come forth to put them out of their Weis misery?  

More intriquing ...why does a program with all the athletic advantages and assets on the planet ...continue to languish 15 years post-Holtz?

Kiner homers............Buc's lose (Well Almost.)

Never saw a worse 4th quarter meltdown (buy both coach and QB. Just horrible........... but predictable.)

Can't understand for the life of me why they didn't pound the rock more in those close yardage 3rd downs situations with thier thick fullback???

********

(Pitt had three possession (other than the final one) in the fourth quarter. They scored a touchdown, had a three and out and had a first down and out. I don't understand how that is a ``meltdown.''  Since when is scoring a touchdown on 33 percent of your possessions a ``meltdown?'' -- Bob Smizik)

Bob if you think the boo's were bad on Stull earlier in the season, you should have heard the LSU fans booing their back-up QB in last night's La. Tech vs LSU game.

(Was the backup quarterback among the nation's leaders in passing efficiency? -- Bob Smizik)

Good game from Pitt's d-line. Notre Dame is not getting the reults from the talent they have. Blame Weis for that.

Can't believe Stull's parents feel isolated by the Pitt fans.

Stull gutted out the situation, he had no choice. He wasn't able to transfer to another team.

This is NOT going to evolve into a Pitt-Penn State blog, which is why I have edited some comments and am deleting this one.  -- Bob Smizik

Bob,

You can tout Stull's numbers all you like. Number's don't always give the best picture of a QB.

This is why the coaches fear allowing Stull to throw deep over the middle and when he does it strikes fear into the hearts of fans and coaches alike.

He even has trouble throwing screen passes.

Now I will admit Bill Stull throws a nice deep pass (often on target, but aside from that he's a mediocre QB.)

BTW: A 6'5" WR can make almost any QB look good.

(I wrote that he didn't play his best game but was ``good enough.'' I think that fairly covered the situation.  Tell me, how has he completed 66 percent of his passes this season with all the shortcomings you attribute to him? -- Bob Smizik)

Bob,

It's simple: Stull does the dink & dunk routine and as stated by a previous poster gets alot of circus style catches from the 6'5" Baldwin.

I did say he throws a nice long bomb.

Bob maybe Stull leads us to the promised land and a nice BCS bid, but c'mon as a fan I'm on needles and pins when this go goes throws over the middle or even ordinary dinks & dunks. What really gets me is that his ineptitude is mental (i.e., he has the tools to be a consistent steady QB if he could get past the jitters.)-My opinion anyway.

(How could you possibly know about his mental makeup? Have you ever met him? Have you ever talked to anyone who knows him?  You're playing couch-potato psychologist.  And for you to use the word ``ineptiude'' about him after the season he's had is beyond belief. 

I don't think he's the best QB in America.  Far from it. But after 10 games, I think he deserves at least a little bit of credit.

He had gains of 21, 36 and 51 yards. How's that dink and dunk?  -- Bob Smizik)

I'll admit that the overrule on the fumble/incomplete pass was questionable, but only because there was no indisputable evidence either way.  Regardless of whether the call was a fumble or an incomplete pass, the booth should have left it stand.  Having said that, you still have to give Romeus credit for beating his man and creating the situation in the first place, as well as acknowledge that Notre Dame wasn't exactly denied an opportunity at 4th and inches.  It would have been 4th and 16.

As for Pitt's tight play nearly costing them the game, It took a punt return for a touchdown for Notre Dame to get back within one score and, as Bob pointed out, they did score in the 4th quarter.  And I don't believe that Wannstedt called for the fumbled snap that ended the one drive, so that stopped Pitt from running more clock.

And yes Stull had a bit of an off game compared to what he's done this season, but he also had a few passes dropped, including a TD pass, so while Baldwin bailed him out,  a couple times, it evened out over the course of the game.  I just love that a bad game by the kid garners a 135 passer rating.

Whistle Pig, while you were busy making fun of a kid's hair (what did you and your friends look like at that age?), you failed to notice that he is a true sophmore, so he can't leave for the NFL until after next season.  It's just as well, because he still can improve and raise his draft status.

Hey Bob,

Good piece.

Its time - finally - for those who are not buying into Coach Wannstedt to sit down and shut-up for a while. This is clearly most balanced Panther team we've seen in a very long time.

I'm sorry for Bill Stull parents....he's a tought, gritty kid. Did anyone see the tremendous block he threw on Graham's big run?

OK...I'll admit to a little case of "oh no's" when we could not convert on 3rd and 2 and then punted the ball right to Golden Tate....geez the ND faithful sprang up like VIet Cong in a rice paddy!

I'm still not sure what happened on Clausen's fumble....but if it was a bad call, condsider it  the law of averages swinging abck in the other direction....recallng the "halo rule" call that we were on the short end of in South Bend a few years back.

This team is for real and strangely enough....I find my some wondering, "what the heck will we do without Bill Stull behind center next year?" ...a bit of a contrast to what I felt after the Sun Bowl.

Bring on the 'eers!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bob,

I give Bill Stull props for hanging in there. Lesser guys might have quit and I wish him all the best, but I cannot let political correctness and wishful thinking to get into the way of our frank football analysis in here.

When I speak of his mental makeup I am referring to his uneven/awkward/inconsistent style of play- just an observation.

As I've said Pitt is stuck with him for better or worse.

Bob you speak with forked tongue! Your headline for this post is "Stull, Wanndstedt Looking Good for Pitt" then you go on to say in the above post that "he (stull) didn't play his best game but was good enough"

Well? Was he "looking good for Pitt" or just good enough to win. There is a difference.

(The headline was referring to the way this season has played out and Pitt being a 9-1 team. In any regard, can you deny that Stull is looking good? -- Bob Smizik)

In Stull's "bad game" when he only looked "good enough," he still looked better than most college quarterbacks.  If you got a quarterback who throws a good long ball while also making good decisions throwing short balls, what's wrong with that?  Is Pitt not scoring enough?  Are they turning the ball over?  Having trouble on thrid down?  No.  

He probably doesn't have an NFL career in his future, but there are a lot of schools that would love to have their quarterback be as "Inept" as Bill Stull.  This is the 4th ranked passer in the country and it's not like he's the only one asked to throw screens.

Bob -

I see we are sensoring things today AGAIN. NIce!

How about if we all just agree with everything you say so you leave our comments posted?

Pirates are great....

Stull was boo'd

anything else you will ALLOW us to post?

(99 percent of what is written stays as is. I reserve the right to keep the focus on the topic and to make sure something resembling good taste prevails. I believe what I deleted of yours was in extremely poor taste.

For you to suggest I am asking people to agree with everything I write is ridiculous.-- Bob Smizik)

Playing QB in Pittsburgh is one of the toughest sports jobs around. People love to complain about Big  Ben, even though he's helped to win two Super Bowls and a ton of games. I'm sure Bill Stull can sympathize.

Stull is nowhere near Big Ben's league, but he is an above average college QB who has used his tools and the players around him to lead Pitt to its best season in decades.

While that's not good enough for some people, who apparently expect perfection, it is certainly good enough for a successful and excing season that could end in a BCS bowl.

Pitt was on the ropes big time & should be thankful for the following, which allowed them to escape impending disaster:

- Clausen taking the second timeout was huge, as Weis was furious when with 19 seconds still on the play clock, Clausen returned to the sidelines instead of huddling up & running a play. That timeout was invaluable as you could read Weis' lips on the sideline saying he wanted at least 2 timeouts to stop the clock on first & second down, should they not convert the fourth down.

- As for the fourth down that wouldn't be, not only was the fumble overrule incorrect, the timeout should have been given back & that was what  Weis was arguing extensively after the blown call.

- Wannstedt escapes yet another game management blunder (which is the main reason he was a failure at the next level) in calling a timeout with about 3 min. remaining in a 5 point game, prior to PUNTING the ball away on 4th down???

Did I just sign on to the  "I hate Pitt, Bill Stull and Wanny" web page?  I could understand the criticism after the first three seasons, but Pitt is 19-5 in their last 24 games under this inept coach, and it all began with that stunning upset at Morgantown with Pat Bostick at QB.  Would you rather he had led the Panthers to a couple more 5-7 seasons instead?  I didn't understand the time out call before the punt, but c'mon, the bashing of how he coached last night is insane.  With the way the Pitt defense played, why would you not keep punting the ball and giving ND a long field?  How is it Wanny's fault that his punter screwed up and kicked the ball in the wrong direction?  That happens every game in the NFL.

I could understand the criticism of Stull after the Sun Bowl, but at some point you've got to credit a 66% completion rate and an 18-4 Td to Int ratio.   The one thing I've noticed with quarterbacks is that it takes a while for them to recover from concussions.  Usually a lot longer than it takes for them to actually return to action.    Nobody on the field processes more information in a shorter period of time than a quarterback.  There is a fine margin of error at the position.  A year removed from his concussion, Bill Stull is processing much better than he did in that bowl game.  

Discounting his numbers because Baldwin makes spectacular catches is just plain ignorant.   Do you credit his completion percentage when a receiver drops a good throw?  How many circus catches did Swann and Stallworth make for Bradshaw?   How many great catches did Larry Fitzgerald make for Palko?  Nobody criticized Palko for it, or Curt Warner for what Fitz does for him in the NFL.  Part of what a good quarterback does is to put the ball in a position for only his man to make the play.  Either make a  play on the ball, or it is an incompletion.  That is what a good QB should do.  Give your playmakers a chance to make a play.

If you want to bury the kid for being 9 for 100 for 50 yards in the Sun Bowl, fine, but have the character to credit him for what he has done since he fully recovered from his concussion.  And don't discount the subtraction of Matt Cavanaugh as the coordinator.  Cavanaugh was a bad OC for the Ravens, and he didn't do much better for Pitt.

BlitzburghD,

Disagree on the fumble. I thought it was a clear fumble from the get go.

As far as Wannstedt goes? This guy appears to be on the edge of meltdown whether his team is way ahead or behind.

It appears that this Pitt team just lacks that ability to close strong. I don't know who's fault that is.

I do know that if the commander appears to be losing it, the players can't be too far behind.

What Cignetti & Co. need to remember is come crunch time the ball goes into the hands of Lewis, Graham, Hynoski, and Baldwin. If that doesn't work...............PUNT.

Since we all know how much you love to keep harping on the Bill Stull is hated and booed story, was it you that tipped of ABC and Lisa Salters about his parents location?  Even Paul Zeise who wrote about this story quite a bit this season, feels it is ridiculous to keep bringing it up this late in the season.

(If that had been the parents of a Penn State QB choosing to watch the game from the North Pole instead of the 50-yard line, I doubt you would have thought it ridiculous. That was good TV by ABC. I commend Salters for coming up with the story. Anyone who can't see that as a good story for a sideline reporter is blinded by their Pitt loyalty. --- Bob Smizik

agree that there was not enough evidence to overturn, and esepcially agree that ND should have been the TO back after the play was overturned ... but seriously doubt that either changed the outcome of the game.

Retire21 .. you wrote exactly what I was going to write about Bradshaw and Swann as well as Rutherford and Fitzgerald.  Stull obviously put the ball where Baldwin can catch it and the db couldn't.  One thing not mentioned is the nice play he made early in the 1st period when he evaded a rusher and floated a nice touch pass into the endzone only to have O Turner juggle it out of bounds.  He did ave a poor game (by his current standards) but at least he didn't throw any INTs which would have been proven to be fatal.

Good grief...I can't understand some people. I was listening to George Von Benko/Panther Hotline on the way home from the game last night and all the wailing and moaning after a WIN? Jeez....

I thought it was interesting that there was a student holding up a large poster of Wannstedt. It was showed on the Jumbotron several times during the game..two years ago it would have invited a chorus of boos. Now Wanny is an icon..

C'mon folks...let's enjoy the ride!

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Well it's official now, Pitt has truly arrived. Now some Pitt fans are complaining about wins..........

I thought Stull managed the game well and I'm sure he knew that if he put it up to Baldwin in single coverage that he would come down with he ball. That's just smart football.

I can't wait to see Pitt's final 3 games.

I gotta believe that story about Stull's parents didn't do wonders for Pitt's quarterback recruiting.

Retire #21 is right about Cavenaugh minimizing the production from the talent we've had on offense, culminating in that bizarrely horrendous Sun Bowl. Is there an award for assistant coach of the year?

there is an award for assistant coach of the year award .. I believe it's called the Frank Broyles Award.  F Cignetti should be in the running.

It is the Frank Broyles Award and get this ... Johnny Majors is on the selection committee

www.broylesaward.com/about-the-award

Comcast Pay-per-View fee (game not on ABC in Midwest states, nuts!):  $24.

Refreshments and snacks:  another $20.

Lou Holtz admitting Pitt is a great team on ESPN, while humbly wearing a Pitt jersey and Pitt hat in from of a gloating (and glowing) Mark May:  priceless!

Ohio State beats Penn State, Bengals Sweep Steelers, & University of Cincinnati beats Pitt .... the perfect trifecta!

Five things I never thought could possibly happen after last year’s Sun Bowl debacle:

1.  Bill Stull is compared favorably to Notre Dame’s golden-boy all-everything QB in the game build-up, then out-duels him on national TV.

That’s no knock on Clausen, he’s a great player.  But Stull was better at using the tools at his disposal.  Which makes him a better QB.

And maybe a tougher QB too.  I didn’t see Clausen make any great down-field blocks, ala Brett Favre.  Stull did.

2.  Stull wins a “Helmet Sticker” on ESPN (happened after the USF game).  Given by Lou Holtz.

3.  Blame for last year’s Sun Bowl whiff starts looking more and more every day to be coaching (more specifically, offensive coordinating & QB coaching, all in one unnamed guy).  

Concussion recovery time?  Higher confidence levels?  Sure, all that helped.  But I think most of the difference in Stull this year can be summed up in one word: Cignetti.

Gives me great hopes for another work-in-process rebuilding project named Pat Bostick.

4.  Is there a “most improved player” award in college football?  If there is, and if Stull doesn’t win it, they should cancel the award ceremony.

5.  ImmaManIm40’s phone calls to Heather Locklear are unblocked (we’re still waiting for that one…).

To Whistle Pig:

“…He's not one of the 2 best college receivers yet, but he is pretty doggone good…”.

Just curious, please name two receivers you think are better than Baldwin?  You’re entitled to your opinion, of course, but I cannot name ANY better receivers in CFB.

The guy is long, fast, has soft hands, great hops, great attitude.  Did you see him preaching to the scorched DBs last night, keeping their heads in the game?  And now that we’re starting to get him the ball regularly, his numbers will be freakish, off the hizzle.

I’ll go one step further.  Hypothetically speaking of course, were I the GM of a new CFB franchise, I’d take Baldwin over everybody else in my expansion draft.  Everybody.

Finally, for what it’s worth, JB is a true sophomore.  Thus he cannot bolt for the NFL for at least one more year (after this one).

Bob, your blog should start a "Baldwin for Heisman" campaign for next season.  It's not too soon.

Imma Man ...you might be right on all counts.  I'm sure you are on the soph thing.  I had it in my noggin he was a jr. equiv.  

And your breakdown of his skills is compelling.  I guess I'll just say I doubt all but one other in the country are lesser. The key, and I've not the insight you've offered, is his head.  Many would have said same of Plex.  Unfortunately he had it all but a brain.  Where's the Wiz when he's needed?  

So let me give it back.  If JB's #2, who's #1?

Whistle Pig,

As I said, I cannot think of any better receivers in CFB than Baldwin.  Admittedly, some of that is his potential, but not all of it.

So let me flip it around.  Since JB is my #1 WR, here are some candidates for #2:  closest candidate is Julio Jones, 'Bama (more or less equal, but I think JB has better hands).

Runners-up: Golden Tate, ND (but behind because JB is much bigger, has better hops).  Marty Gilliard, Cincy (JB ahead for same reasons).  Jordan Shipley, Texas (same reasons).  The DQ'd dude from Okie State (similar size, but he didn't play ... plus JB has better attitude).

And other than J.Jones (isn't he a true soph too?) all those guys are all juniors or seniors, I think.  Since JB is younger, he presumably has a higher ceiling.

I did that list from memory, so I'm probably missing somebody obvious.  Can anyone else think of other worthy candidates?

This just in: Pitt is #9 in this week's BCS rankings.

Nice work.  Your memory and knowledge of the big pic is far superior to mine.  Interesting ideaa.

Indeed he could be a potential Fitzgerald.  Or Fitz predecessor.  His name?  

In any case, we'd disagree on his being a #1 choice.  At least until he transforms his 'do into a legitimate mullet.

A few more thoughts ...

as wonderful a season as Pitt's having, and they are ...WHO here would have bet a buck they'd be 9-1???? ...this is NOT a #9 team.  A handful of SEC teams would clobber this bunch of overachievers.

And none have offered insight to my earlier wondering:

WHY would the Big EAST assign a lifetime Pittsburgher as referee to a game in Pittsburgh and notably labeled Pitt's biggest contest in many moons.  Simply courting disaster.

Bob,

As a former sportswriter and someone who enjoys the improvisational jazz stylings of Dave Brubeck, I have to say I appreciate the good coverage your blog has provided of this exceptional Pitt season.

On the topic of Bill Stull - and being serious for once - people have no idea what Mr. and Mrs. Stull have been through. You know how many of us have had the experience of having a child playing major college athletics, especially at such a prominent position? I doubt it includes anyone posting here. Yes, there are benefits to the position Bill Stull has on this team. Yes, scrutiny is part of the deal. Yes, I believe the QB - or any player, really - at a major college program should expect to be criticized by the fans. There is good with the bad, and that is assumed. But I KNOW what people have said about Stull - and this isn't the booing, which was technically directed at the coaching staff. Some of the things his parents have overheard - or have outright had directed at them - are things you would hope decent people wouldn't say to members of Al Quaida.

When it comes to the booing, I still maintain that the media in this town is as culpable as anyone for creating the atmosphere from which the behavior sprang. I know, Bob, the media's an easy target. But the media also doesn't always understand the amount of power it actually has.

As for the childish behavior of many fans around Heinz Field on Saturdays, as it pertains to Bill Stull, grow up.

Fitz's predecessor: do you perhaps mean Antonio Bryant?  Fitz was better, and I think JB is too (or certainly will be before he's done at Pitt).  

Like Fitz and Bryant before him, JB had better win the Biletnikoff (sp?) award next year, or they should cancel the award ceremony.

I still say it's a crying shame that Jason White won the Heisman over Fitz.  Jason White??  He wasn't even the best player on OU's offense, let alone the best player in America.

That was the year the Heisman began to morph into the award to the starting QB on the best team, not the most outstanding player.

Tim Tebow?  I can think of ten players that are "more outstanding" this year.

Whistle,

With all due respect, at the risk of being a Pitt homer, I don't think any SEC teams would clobber Pitt this year the way we are closing out the season.

Las year, Florida wouldda clobbered us just on team speed, maybe LSU too.  But 'Bama was absolutely depantsed by Utah.

This year Florida is a step slower, and LSU lost a lot too.  'Bama might be th same or better except at QB.

Point being: if we face those "big three" SEC teams (Florida, LSU or 'Bama) in a bowl, they'd all be favored over Pitt, but not by a lot.  And they wouldn't clobber us, barring turnovers we might even win a close game.

For all the other nine SEC teams, I think Pitt would both be slighly favored and win.

Two Points of Order to "BengalsSweep2010":

1.  You mentioned your perfect trifecta is two Bungles wins over the Stillers, a Bearcats win over Pitt, and a Bug-eyes win over the Nits.

That's four things; a trifecta is only three.  hence, the "tri" prefix.  Dunno if there's such a thing as a quadfecta (it didn't pass spell-check).

Let's subract the Bearcats' pending loss to Pitt, that still leaves you with three (and three things that have actually transpired...).

2.  Sez here 2010 is next year.  Your Bearcats might wanna focus on THIS year's game, or they'll be dump-trucked by the mighty Panthers on 5-Dec.

If it matters, I'm a Bug-eyes fan too, once per year: when they play the Nits.

Woodshed,   maybe you should 'Take 5"   The fuss made by the media in the opener was justified, but not so much after that.  

My guess is that the Stulls happened to sit next to a few loud-mouthed boneheads who think that cursing out the QB and the coach is a way of showing off their knwsledge .. and it happens on both Saturday and Sunday at Heinz as well as almost every stadium. It happened at the Horseshoe for much of this year, and I assume happened in Beaver Stadium last week.

Nonetheless, I do agree that as a parent, it would be very hard to take.

I was very young when Pitt enjoyed its brief run of dominance in the late 70s and early 80s. I just wanted to say that I am really enjoying this run. I have waited a long time for it. Go Panthers. Let's finish it out!

I wish that I could learn that there is no point trying to argue with the "Pitt fans" or Nitters who try to belittle or nit pick every single aspect in every game whether valid, somewhat valid or ridiculous the point or claim is. Their agenda is based on something other than the reality of the situation and will manipulate the truth to "prove" their point. It's as pointless arguing politics or religion. There are about 110 football teams in this country that wishes they were in the position Pitt is in.

Good for Bill Stull. You can say what you want about his quarterback skills, but no one can deny that this kid is about as mentally tough as 22 or 23 year old comes. I don't know that any poster here could have handled his situation remotely close to how he has.

One thing I noticed last night was the entire Stull family avoided "eye contact" with fans via the camera.  Just stared ahead.  

Point being, I though they were making a not-so subtle point back that they weren't very happy with "us" because "we" weren't very happy with their son's body of work for awhile.  I guess that's understandable.

Regardless, now that Stull has won over true fans, will his family return to their seats?  collegesportsfan is right, ignoramuses are everywhere and will say almost anything, especially with a little liquor.

Then again, maybe it doesn't matter: one more home game, and Stull will be off to his future.

To that, just curious, has anyone seen any pro draft projections for Stull?  (That's another post Sun Bowl question I never thougth I'd be asking...).  But it's no longer laughably impossible, especially in Canada or the UFL.  

@ Whistle Pig about why the Big East assigned a Pgh guy to ref the game..Probably the same reason the repaly official in Cincy/WVU ruled a TD instead of a fumble that tied the game at 14-14 instead of WVU leading 14-7 and having the ball inside their own 5 - to ensure the "right teams" won on Sat............That replay call  that went against WVU was horrible and was the difference in the game...

Onto Stull - I admit I have been a critic this season despite his improved play....He has played well...I never thought I would see that...BUT.......He does does things that a QB on scholarship at major university should never do.........

His lack of poise in pressure situations is un-nerving at best....Fumbled snaps???  Thats a fundamental that is mastered in pee-wee football.....Pitt had a chance to run out the clock with over 3 min left with a 3rd and short and he botched the snap - not the first one on Sat either.....His high completion % is a  direct function of great play calls by Cignetti (before you criticize me, any major college QB with weapons like he has and an OC like Cignetti putting him in positions to be successful should be completing 66%)......

Baldwin bailed him out numerous times with great catches where the throws were extremely high and/or off target......His over throw of Lewis on the first drive wasnt exactly a difficult pass - no one was near Lewis either and his protection on this play was solid.....

Look at all the times he got pressured up the middle - happy feet and throws that were very inaccurate and some forces that could have been picked if he was going up a secondary that was at least ordinary.......

I'll give him credit - he has been able to perform better in a town where he has gotten intense scrutiny.....But go back and look over the past two years and the reasons he has gotten criticism is that the interceptions and mental blunders were on plays for the most part shouldnt have occurred.......Just like Big Ben having a defense to bail him out every so often, Stull has benefited from having a good defense back him up..Why do you think teams put 8/9 guys in the box last yr to stop McCoy, because they had no fear of Stull beating them....Getting rid of Cavanaugh was tremendous to his development too - Cignetti obviously worked with him and did what some coaches never learn - you install a scheme to take advantage of your talent - you dont hope to put a square peg into a round hole by forcing playing into your system.....

One final comment on the Sun Bowl.....

Everyone seems to forget that Jason Pinkston, starting left tackle, did not play.  The left tackle is probably the most crucial position on the line.  His replacement, Chase Clowser.....let's just say he didn't do so well.  Add to the fact that Joe Thomas also had a pretty bad day at the office and Stull had no supoport from his o-line.  The running game really couldn't get cranked up because of that either.  Finally, had to be one of the worse called games by Cavanaugh ever.  8 lobs to Baldwin?

I'm not absolving Stull, he played bad.  But he had a lot of help in that department also, not the least of which was the offensive line.  He won't make anyone forget Marino, or Rod Rutherford, but he is more than capable of leading the team to victory, kind of in a Craig Kenzel mode from Ohio State a while back.

NOW, it gets INTERESTING...  .  A BEast championship game in 3 weeks at The Bottle (thanks, Mark May(?)).  I guess you've gotta win at WVU to maintain the momentum, but winning at a sold out Heinz Field, under the lights, on ABC, against a big-time non-conference foe was so VERY important in giving Pitt the confidence to win the BEast.  NOW, winning at a sold-out stadium at WVU could give Pitt the confidence to win a "road" game in a bowl against the SEC.  But one game at a time.........  .

Very unfortunate about Stull's parents, but I'm sure that Roethlisberger's parents don't sit with the Joe Schmo's either.  Pitt should give all QB's parents box seats.

Whatever happened to the art of punting the ball out of bounds?  I researched this about a month ago, and there are reasons now why coaches shy away from doing this.  But the reasons were quite strange, IMHO.

Concerning the referee from PGH..., isn't this a somewhat non-issue since he was part of the crew that called the controversial play an 'incomplete pass' (a call which went against Pitt)?  Or was he the guy in the booth?

Unfortunately, what Stull's parents are experiencing goes on at every program at one time or another. Anyone who believes otherwise is ignorant. That doesn't make it right, but it's a fact. From now on, Pitt fans should just ignore what is written and it will soon go away. Don't fall for the bait.

(Please name the program where the quarterback of a 4-1 team, who is among the nation's leaders in passing efficiency, is booed by his home fans?

Also name the program where parents of the starting QB on an 8-1 team don't feel comfortable sitting in their own seats?

You say this goes on in ``every'' program.  Name one?   --   Bob Smizik

Mr. Pitt,

I believe that a "run" usually lasts longer than one season.  Give me a call when Pitt has continued success and not just Rutgers, Louisville, UConn, USF or the latest Big Least team du jour.

As for the Lisa Salters interview with Stull's parents, it is obvious to me that Stull's parents are actually PSU homers who are simply trying to disparage the great Pitt program and their loyal fans.  They KNOW that there was no booing (or it was limited to three students who have subsequently failed out of school), but they insist on retelling this lie because they - like Bob Smizik - secretly love JoePa.  

To Sarcastic Sword,

FWIW, I didn't care who won the Cincy-WVU game, but I thought the replay refs got the call right in overturning Cincy's fumble and giving them back the ball.  If you still can, take a look at the runner at his apex: he thrust the ball forward, the end of it appears (to me) to pass beyond the innermost (field-side) part of the endzone stripe.  In fact, the end of the ball  looked to me to penetrate almost to the endzone side of the stripe.  That's a TD.

But even that didn't cost 'eers the game.  IMHO, they lost it on the very questionable coaches' decision on the critical series right before their last TD: to "go for it" on 4th down rather than try for a FG (the same FG they needed at the end).

To your other point RE Stull: "...Why do you think teams put 8/9 guys in the box last yr to stop McCoy, because they had no fear of Stull beating them...".

ND did the same thing to open the game, which is why Stull came out throwing.  And if you re-watch the 4th Qtr, ND did the same thing at the end.  But in fact, Stull did beat them.  The running game didn't open up until after Stull hit a bunch of passes, made them back off and respect the pass. Last year, with ND's athletes, sez here that might notta happened.

to refresh your memory once again about the Sun Bowl, here is an excerpt from ESPN's Brian Bennett posted immediately after the game:

It's not fair to pin all the blame on quarterback Bill Stull. He was running for his life most plays, got knocked down a ton and even hurt his wrist. The biggest factor was that Pitt played without left tackle Jason Pinkston, who had a shoulder injury. Oregon State's defensive line absolutely decimated the Pittsburgh offensive front, which had been a strength of the team most of the season.Then there was a snapping wind that made throwing long patterns difficult, if not impossible, for both teams.

Still, Stull had been very shaky down the stretch this season, and he didn't have a strong enough arm to combat the wind. Why offensive coordinator Matt Cavanaugh didn't call more short passes or over-the-middle routes is a mystery to me. The long fades to Jonathan Baldwin had no chance of working.

You know, any number of us can and often do play tough guy-smart a**-know-it-all cynics.  Count me among the guilty as charged.  

But ...this is a time for joy and jubillation for all Pitt Panther loving patrons, especially parents.

Watching Bill Stull's parents presumably feeling as rejected as their son felt 4 or 5 games ago, is heart-breaking.

Think about this ...This has to be the pinnacle of a parental lifetime watching their son struggle, succeed, be booed, rise above it all, and no matter what happens from this moment forward, come out as one of the great success stories in modern Pitt athletic history.  Well done, Billy boy!  You're a Pittsburgher and a Panther that Primanti Bros. ought to honor with a named patty-melt or maybe the Panther Burgher!

You 've made alot of folks happy and proud to be a Panther.

But M/M Stull are obviously in pain, sentenced to the Pitt gulag.  Someone's ought to be bringing them "in from the cold" and doing it now, that they might be among the overtly over-joyed Pittsters celebrating their son's season of all seasons.  They'll likely see no more like this one.  

Who will reach out to them and "ease their pain?"

Color me sentimental, silly ...but let these folks feel some love.  And some Pitt Pride.  And maybe even enjoy a Panther Burgher @ Primanti's.

Fail Pitt,

You are really reaching now.  You do realize how ridiculous you sound, right? No, I will not call you, but I'm sure you 're used to that. Anyone who has a screen name dedicated solelely to disparaging a team probably has a lot of time on his hands. The kind of time people have when other people never call them .

Mr. Pitt,

Reaching?  Do you think that Rutgers fans really knew that their program had not turned the corner back in 2005-2006?  Do you think they knew that they were having flash-in-the-pan success?  Of course not, they thought that the program was here to stay, at the start of a dynastic run.  Kind of like Pitt fans today.

Despite your name calling, I don't see how you've argued my point.  The Big Least has consistently put forther average teams that have one exceptional season and then return to their comfort zone of mediocrity.  I listed those schools.  Pitt will likely join them next year.

You say this goes on in ``every'' program.  Name one?   --   Bob Smizik

Check out #7 on this list, Bob.

collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/.../worst-of-the-weak----leathernecks-no--1

PittNH,

Your response is wrong-headed in forty-eight different ways, but let me just start with three.  Texas Tech was not 4-1 when the chant occurred.  Texas Tech was not 9-1 when the chant occurred.  The QB in question was not performing as Stull has performed.  Weak.

Ever the optimist (please call me, Jennifer Anniston?), and despite his need for a better screen name: "Fail Pitt" right on one narrow point.  For now, I’ll give him the benefit of doubt on the still-unsettled long-term future of the program.  But he’s off-base too:  that proverb is true for EVERY program: if ‘Bama and Oklahoma can have losing seasons under wrong coaches, then no program is immune.

Two consecutive 9-win seasons are GREAT for alumni who attended Pitt between the mid-80s and mid-90s.  And reason to celebrate for fans who (a) endured those years with only occasional glimpses of mediocrity (let alone dominance); and/or (b) tolerated mediocrity to slightly-better (certainly better than before…) under the Walt Harris years.  Although, forever thanks to Walt for raising the program from the dead.

However, I went to Pitt from late 70s to early 80s.  For me, 11-win seasons were the norm, and included beating many of today's big-name programs (including one in the middle of the state).

Point being, 9-win seasons, while great comparatively, still leave something to shoot for.  But by all means, let's all cheer the great progress.  

What I fear is when Wanny retires (like when Pitt crumbled after Jackie Sherrill left, IMHO Pitt never truly recovered until Wannstedt).  Or when they lose key coordinators.  Who will Pitt hire to replace them?  Cavanaugh was no dummy, but he coached with an NFL (read: conservative) mindset.  College ball is a different game than NFL, which is why IMHO Cignetti is thriving when Cav didn’t.  I'm not a lion tamer (which reminds me of my fave Monty Pyton sketch), but I suspect one trains lions differently than elephants – or anteaters.

In CFB, recruiting is everything, and success begets success.  Wanny was a master recruiter when selling a mediocre product his first three years.  But now, if he has 9-11 win BCS-bowl BE champs seasons to sell, plus keeps his college-mindset staff in place?  Sky’s the limit.

Then, "Fail Pitt," I have noooo doubts we'll be calling to you to gloat, as you requested.

Mr. Pitt,

Rutgers is not an elite team, but they are not nearly as bad as you imply. Their record since 2005 (including 2009) is 41-19. Their record for the previous five years was 16-41. I think that some people my construe that as "turning the corner" at least at some level.

You jumped on my mentioning of "run" being to short of a time period. I'll rephrase:

I was very young when Pitt enjoyed its brief run of dominance in the late 70s and early 80s. I just wanted to say that I am really enjoying this season (run). I have waited a long time for it. Go Panthers. Let's finish it out!

I hope this satisfies you. I doubt it.

Correction to my comment.First, I addressed it mistakenly to myself. Also, Rutgers 5 year record previous to 2005 was 15-42 not 16-41. Sorry for the foul up.

I will admit that at the beginning of the season I would have booed Bill Stull if he walked down the isle in my church and I like every other Pitt fan has been proven dead wrong about this kid. He has had a miraculous season aided by a great cast around him. In our section of Heinz field there are countless fans that are happy to have been proven wrong. Keep the good work going and win the next two games so we can get some Suga!

I'm amazed at all the negative comments about Sat's game. For me it was spectacular, the energy in that stadium rivalled last years AFC Championship and to hear that "Let's Go Pitt" chant just ringing out was awesome. There are ebbs and flows to every sporting event and saturdays was no different but in the end our Blue and Gold won the game they set out to and I have nothing negative to say about that.

Hail to Pitt!

Go Gators!

ImmaMan wrote-

"However, I went to Pitt from late 70s to early 80s.  For me, 11-win seasons were the norm, and included beating many of today's big-name programs (including one in the middle of the state)."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

WRONG!  From 1977-1983 PSU won 4 of 7 vs. PITT, as usual your facts are inaccurately skewed to favor your opinion.

BlitzBurghDude-

You've also skewed your facts, since you could have just as easily picked 1976-1984, in which the two schools were even at 4-4-1.  More importantly, in the 4 years that Pitt won at least 11 games during that era, Pitt beat Penn St 3 times, so yes, ImmaMan is right when he ties beating Penn St to those 11 win seasons.

GTurner-

What part of late 70's - early 80's do you not understand?  I was actually generous in including 77-83 in that equation...

Late 70s early 80s could cover anything from 1976-1985.  It's hardly specific.  Regardless, you still picked a period that was most convenient to your argument.  After all, if you pick  a 4 year period in which Pitt winning 11 was the norm, whether it's 78-81 or 79-82, the rivalry was split 2-2.

GTurner-

I didn't "pick" any time period, your boy Imma qualified it as late 70's-early 80's.  '85 = mid eighties?  C'mon dude!  Common sense would surely indicate:

'73, '74, '75 & '76 = mid 70's

'77, '78 & '79 = late 70's

'80, '81 & '82 = early 80's

'83, '84, '85 & 86 = mid 80's

BlitzBurghDude,

I attended Pitt from Sept. 1976, graduated April 1980.  Four years to get a 4-year degree.  Is that okay with you?

So my facts are correct:  whle attending Pitt, we did indeed beat the team from the middle of the state (split 2-2).  I never said they beat them every year.

Do me a favor, please keep the repeated personal attacks to a minimum.  I don't knowingly slur you or any other blogger.

Bob, frankly, I'm a little surprised you've let that stuff slide.

(My oversight. Tough to keep up with everything he writes. It has been taken care of. -- Bob Smizik)

ImmaMan,

Surprising that you replied, since you've ignored my past challenges of your skewing the facts for the purpose of spinning it in favor of your opinion.  

As for Bob letting that stuff slide, I don't personally attack others on this blog, but if you choose to post inaccuracies & half truths, I'll be sure to point them out, censorship or not!

BlitzBurghDude,

Pointing out, in your words, my inaccuracies and half truths?  That's fair game, in fact it's great fun.  And goes both ways.

Although permit me to observe that your pointing them out doesn't necessarily make me wrong (or you right).  Most of this stuff is opinions and school rivalries, where there is no right or wrong.

However, stooping to personal attacks, ridicule and name-calling is out of bounds.

ImmaMan-

Agreed, MOST is merely opinion, but I wholeheartedly disagree with spinning the FACTS in order to support that opinion & I'll bring it to light when it is spun inaccurately.  If you're opposed to my doing so, you don't need my permission to prove me wrong..