Perry Hill can be replaced

Bob -

While I understand where you are getting the WR coach for the Steelers comparison, there are some differences:

- The Steelers are a 1st class organization with a owner committed to winning

- the Pirates are a non-class organization with an owner committed to lining his pockets.

I point this out because whose to say the Pirates will fill the position with another top notch coach.  

That being said, I think the major uproar with this is that it appears to be another major blemish for this pathetic franchise (in a long line of blemishes...ie.. sano, 17 losing seasons, salary dumps).  This guy appears to rather not coach than to come back and be part of this mess...... what does that say about the situation on the North shore?

Bob,

You are Fantastic.........Balderdash!

Who cares [Ref the Pirates]?

Another Neal Huntington Decision---was it again money, or did Perry Hill follow his heart?

Only on these blog sites is Perry Hill leaving a big deal, I agree with Bob, we got a good one in Hill and too say there is not another good one out there is ridiculous.

The Pirates are a class operation and everything they are trying to do, they do with class.

They are not always right, but that has nothing to do with class.

Leadoff -

Pocketing the Revenue sharing money instead of spending it as intended is low class

"they are not always right" -  WHen have they been right?  Not in 17 years!

The reason why Perry leaving is a big deal is because the Pirate supporters (and FO) sung his praises often and pointed to him as a step in the right direction.... now that he bolted, it's not a big loss?  

leadoff-

Class clowns of MLB, in regards to the Pirates & class that is.

Who cares if Perry Hill can be replaced?

The point of the matter is the fact that the Pirates have been abandoned by another MLB person because of the way they do business.

Hill has indirectly made it very clear that he was lied to when he asked if the front office planned on rebuilding in '09.

Perhaps they have that right....but do they have to lie to everyone about it?

If I'm Perry Hill, I can go anywhere and coach for a Triple A team at best.

Only washed up minor league baseball coaches with a career losing record would want to be a part of the current "biggest fiasco" in sports.

I hope the Pirates fans (there IS only like 3 or 4 of you) are enjoying the World Series, and watching a class organization that is good for the game, like the Yankees, try for another championship. Just remember the Pirates will NEVER NEVER NEVER EVER make the World Series or postseason again, and NEVER NEVER NEVER EVER even break the .500 mark again. GUARANTEED. Baseball needs more teams like the Yankees who are a credit for the sport, and less teams like the Pirates, who have always been a Cancer on the game.

imbetterthenyouare,

imbetterthAnyouare...

^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^

that ARE only 1 man's opinion

So why did Joe Kerrigan stay?

I got to go back to when I didn't read your stuff...

Look up the stats DK provided on percentage of balls in play, fielding percentage, and winning percentage.  The sabermetrics for the Bucs fielding were way out of wack for their record.  Then consider the improvement in little LaRoche and Freddy, among others.  Then listen to the comments by other big leaguers - Derrick Lee (who is a pretty good fielder) for one.  Lastly, look at where the Rays went with him, and then without him (certainly is wasn't all him, but go look).

Sure, Beasley can replace him - like Gary Moeller replaced Schembechler, or perhaps the way McClendon replaced Leyland.  Maybe Beasley pulls it off, but why would you want a student of the teacher to train the pupils when it could have been the teacher?

And your Steeler comparison?  Yesterday you had somebody bring up 1949 in discussing Pitt's inclusion in the Big Ten.  Comparing the NFL and MLB is a stretch, let alone the best run NFL franchise and an MLB franchise that you have pointed out has questionable management during the past summer (I believe the trade of Nate, for one, raised your eyebrows).  By the way, the Ravens are feeling pains of a d coordinator change (especially since some players believed in him enough to follow).

The fact is nobody can name another infield instructor, and it doesn't seem that players buzz to the Post Gazette beat writer about anybody else on this coaching staff - or any other.  It would have been great to keep him.

I agree Bob and others....I mean we've all been so beaten down by the Pirates and I was furious over the whole Sano thing...but two wrongs don't make a right.

I don't mean to devalue the importance of a good coach either...but he's just an infield coach. There are probably thousands of people qualified to do that job....the key is how you get your message across as a again agree with Bob wholeheartedly.

But to kiss his behind when there are so many others who could do it? Nope.

And he may have been ticked that rebuilding went on....but did he really think tweaking Jack and Freddy's DP prowess was really going to be the thing that propelled the Pirates to the postseason? He knew I'm sure what he was getting into....he may just legitimately have had enough and really does want to stay home. Can't fault him for that.

Bob, thanks for stating the facts about Perry Hill.  A good coach, but there are hundreds others out there just like him.  It might be wishful thinking, but here's hoping that your article will prevent turning this turning this topic into what the Why-didn't-they-resign-Doug- Mientkiewicz-topic was last winter.

(By the way, I recently heard that the Pirates wanted to sign Mientkiewicz, but the deal was nixed by Bob Nutting's nephew -- Bill Stull.  --  Bob Smizik)

Hi, Bob,

  I don't disagree with you that there are plenty of other good coaches out there.  And the fact that none of us here on this Blog can think of any names may not be as telling as it seems, since we are not professional Baseball people, merely enthusiasts.

  I do, however, wonder at the difficulty that this new coach may have in gaining the players' trust.  I believe that this trust factor may have had a lot to do with the improvements in play that we saw this year.  Now it is once again broken.  That gives our new coach one more hurdle to overcome.  I hope we get a good one - he'll have his work cut out for him!

(Not to diminish Hill, the only noticeable improvement I saw was from Andy LaRoche.  Sanchez was a somewhat above average second baseman before last season and last season, in my estimation. -- Bob Smizik)

BFD:

I am not defending the woeful Pirates.  However, let's see how deep the pockets of the Rooney's are if the NFL salary cap is abolished.

msb46 -

They will still have a desire to win and have great management.... neither of which the Pittsburgh Prospect can say.

msb46 wrote re: Perry Hill can be replaced

on Fri, Oct 30 2009 2:14 PM

BFD:

I am not defending the woeful Pirates.  However, let's see how deep the pockets of the Rooney's are if the NFL salary cap is abolished.

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It's something I have been thinking about myself. How long would it be before the Steelers became like the Pirates, at least in terms of financial ability, if there were no salary cap in the NFL?

As far as Hill, it is another embarassing chapter in this long losing era of Pirates baseball. Maybe he really does just want to spend more time with his family. To rather not coach at all then finish his contract with the Pirates does say a lot though.

emoneypitt -

The Stillers (if the cap was taken away) would probably not be able to win multiple championships in a decade, but I will guarentee they would not finish below 500 for 17 consecutive seasons.  There is no reasonable excuse for that.... especially when the public funded your home (PNC ppark) and you (as owner Robert Nutting) are raking in millions.

I don't think some realize how difficult a task this is to lose more games than you win for 17 straight seasons..... and to have many more on the horizon.  There is no end in sight.

"...the Pirates wanted to sign Mientkiewicz, but the deal was nixed by Bob Nutting's nephew -- Bill Stull..."

Bob, please to tell! I have to admit that I am one who does not believe in Neal Huntington, Frank Coonelly, and how they appear to tell fans one thing, while always intending to do another. But I am all ears to this inside info on Mientkiewicz, if there is more you can divulge.

Oh, okay. You got me. Shows how completely I blocked out the previous "Bill Stull Controversy." This one sailed over my head... and dropped an egg on my face.

Perry Hill was obviously a good infield coach who thought "outside the box" in all of his coaching techniques. His infielders have always believed in him, and he has obviously made a difference in the defensive development of a few players.

I'm sure that his desire not to return to Pittsburgh in 2010 has more to do with a total difference in philosophy between him and the front office and possibly even in total team management philosophy between him and John Russell.

But the real problem is not Perry Hill. The problem is the fact that the Pirates have no more than a handful of true major league players. Maybe there are five major league caliber players on the 40 man roster who could play for a competitive, not a AAAA, major league team.

You can't make chicken sald out of .....

But Perry Hill did the best he could.

You may have changed my mind on this one Bob?  Before your post, I was of the opinion that Huntington dropped the ball again re: Hill wanting to leave, as Huntington may have done with the prospect Sano and in some of his other dealings during 2009 with various players.  More of the same that we got from Littlefield was what I was thinking.

If you're right - Hill is not all that essential, it's the methodology that matters - then maybe this isn't such a blg blow.  One thing is certain - this team needs all the help it can get.  I see years of losing ahead despite the addition of an Alverez in a year.

One last thought - if Hill isn't that essential, how do we explain the improved glove work the Pirates got at 2b and 3b this past season?  Can Garcia or Beasley pick that up and keep it going?

(Who's to say another coach would have not gotten the same improvement out of LaRoche, who was probably more relaxed in his first full seaon and knew the starting job was his? As for Sanchez, I did not detect the level of improvement others saw. -- Bob Smizik)

"Oh, okay. You got me. Shows how completely I blocked out the previous "Bill Stull Controversy." This one sailed over my head... and dropped an egg on my face."

not at all, JL.  it shows your mind has moved on to bigger and better things.

Here's some good news:  Without Perry Hill, they're unlikely to break their own record of being the only team in major league history to have the best defensive infield in the majors and lose 99 games!

Pathetic.   Thanks for nutting!

So Bob, what was wrong with the post? You are a Nutting apologist and have no clue, How sad you and the Pirates are.

• (What was wrong with the post of your I deleted is what's wrong with this one. All you do is throw out overgeneralized critcisms, mostly at Nutting. I am not a Nutting apologist and that comment is so typical of you.  I just got tired of it.
• I am attempting to take this blog to a slightly higher level -- and I emphasize slightly -- and you want to drag it down.  -- Bob Smizik)

sure, Hill can be replaced.  but it's yet another example of the Pirates not paying anybody anything.

and remember when some of you thought the 2 years/10 million offered to and rejected by Sanchez was possibly better than market-rate?  well, Sanchez just signed with San Fran for 2 years/12 million.  

so once again, it turns out the Pirates undervalued (and, as i have believed all along stupidly traded away) one of the few good players they had.

(This is not an example of the Pirats failing to pay. Hill left for reasons other than monetary. -- Bob Smizik)

Bob, that's not what i heard.  i heard he would have stayed in coaching and with us for the right price, but decided to quit when that price was not forthcoming.

(It's my understanding he was under contract for next season. I doubt he was trying to renegotiate. That's pretty much unhead of with coaches. If he was, I don't blame the Pirates for not caving.  --  Bob Smizik)